Have you heard the latest on insurance!

[muddyweb]

Or what about trial vechicles? I've heard of a case where a 90 was being trailored to a display but had old style black number plates on (not legal for that vechicle in this case)but police still pulled the driver over and cautioned him about the plates. This was a display vechicle with no tax etc - at the time dont even think had an engine in as was being restored

Without knowing all the specifics of that, it is hard to comment... but if they did pull him and caution him for it, he would have grounds for complaint.   What we don't know is whether the vehicle was on a SORN certificate, (because if it wasn't, that would warrant a quiet word), if he was driving carefully, if the trailer was in good order, etc. etc....

[Wanderer]

AIUI "No tax or MOT means no Insurance " relates to Insurance companies can invalidate your cover if you do not have MOT (not sure about tax) but they cannot take away the legal minimum cover of third party.

So any incident where a vehicle had no MOT but was covered by insurance it would be the vehicle owners cover that would be lost and any right to claim by third parties.

Maybe Barry could clarify this.

Can you imagine someone with no MOT, but insurance, hitting and outting someone in a wheelchair and the insurance company wriggling out of the payments because their client had been remiss and forgotten to MOT the vehicle in time?

[Priglet]

Or what about trial vechicles? I've heard of a case where a 90 was being trailored to a display but had old style black number plates on (not legal for that vechicle in this case)but police still pulled the driver over and cautioned him about the plates. This was a display vechicle with no tax etc - at the time dont even think had an engine in as was being restored
The point here is if you are taing a trial vechicle to an event or any other non-road use vechicle (again say is a rolling chasis or spraes vechicle) will you still need to produce a valid insurance document if requested?

If that means there are two different number plates visible from the rear of the vehicle then my understanding is that the law is being broken and is why you often see vehicles on transporters with black tape through the middle of the number plate.

Having worked with traffic cops if they have a bad feeling about something they currently don't the right to stop at random but if there is a minor infringement, such as this, they can use it to pull the vehicle and have a closer look.

[the loon]

Or what about trial vechicles? I've heard of a case where a 90 was being trailored to a display but had old style black number plates on (not legal for that vechicle in this case)but police still pulled the driver over and cautioned him about the plates. This was a display vechicle with no tax etc - at the time dont even think had an engine in as was being restored

Without knowing all the specifics of that, it is hard to comment... but if they did pull him and caution him for it, he would have grounds for complaint.   What we don't know is whether the vehicle was on a SORN certificate, (because if it wasn't, that would warrant a quiet word), if he was driving carefully, if the trailer was in good order, etc. etc....

By my understanding it wasnt a full "writen up" caution but just a "friendly word" and check of trailer etc but he was told that the plates where illegal on that  because of vechicle's age.

[Barry Scott]

Trying to catch out uninsured drivers is always going to be a problem with or without this database.  The main problem is even if a vehicle is being driven on the road and the database shows it as uninsured, it may be that it is being driven by someone with the Driving other cars benefit.

Also the problem is that even if a car is taxed, it may be it is not being used on the road so a bit harsh to fine someone, unfortunately this may be the only way.

They need to change the way insurance is purchased and cancelled.  To cancel a policy you should need to either show proof of insurance elsewhere, proof of sale of the vehicle or a copy of the SORN declaration, if none are provided then the insurer could notifiy the authorities.

A £60 fine is also competely useless, it would be cheaper for young drivers to go around uninsured anyway.  I saw a police program where a 17 year old on a provisional was driving with no tax, no mot, no insurance, and the tyres were not road legal, he got fined £150...Bargain.

If someone is uninsured they should auction the car and put the money into the MIB fund for uninsured driver claims.  

By the way, most insurance policies are void if a vehicle requires an MOT and does not have one, they may also argue that an untaxed vehicle should not be on the road.

If I missed anything, let me know.  Not sure how clear and concise that is so sorry if it doesn't make sence.

[Barry Scott]

AIUI "No tax or MOT means no Insurance " relates to Insurance companies can invalidate your cover if you do not have MOT (not sure about tax) but they cannot take away the legal minimum cover of third party.

So any incident where a vehicle had no MOT but was covered by insurance it would be the vehicle owners cover that would be lost and any right to claim by third parties.

Maybe Barry could clarify this.

Can you imagine someone with no MOT, but insurance, hitting and outting someone in a wheelchair and the insurance company wriggling out of the payments because their client had been remiss and forgotten to MOT the vehicle in time?

Yes, the insurer would still be responsible for the third party costs.  They would however have full right of recovery off the policy holder.  This means they could claim their losses from the policy holder.

In most cases no MOT means no insurance.  I have not seen tax mentioned in a policy to this extent but I guess the insurer could argue the vehicle should not been on the road if the road tax has not been paid.

[the loon]

If someone is uninsured they should auction the car and put the money into the MIB fund for uninsured driver claims

I agree on thay I think its mad that vechicles either impounded or seized by police for what ever reason are just crushed  :(

Out of intrest I wonder what the treehuggers say on this. After all most of the cars crushed are ok
Why not auction the vechicle off as is done with unclaimed stolen property etc?
when I lived in exeter I used to pass the local impound yard for on the recovered vechicles taken off the M5 by the highways unit as was near where I worked . Most cars in there where sound but they where crushed as standard practice if not claimed with in 5 weeks mind you the police garage was just up the road and they had some real wrecks that had been seized.But again why not auction these off as scrap. make sure the car itself is beyond use or stip and sell as parts. Get the community service offenders working on this or get them stripped down by prison labour.

[offroading.net]

Jail the gits with no insurance.

I got hit last year by a muppet with no tax, insurance, mot or licence (he was serving a drink driving ban) He hit me while I was stationary in my car, he was on a bike, very near killed himself. All he got was £60 fine and a 1 year community service order. I now pay £250 a year more for my insurace, lost 2 days wages due to no car and paid a £300 excess. And the to55er is taking my insurance company to court for damages :shock:

So yet again a person abiding to the law gets shafted and a law breaker gets away with it, no change there.

I am all for all vehicles being insured, when I built my kit car I had storage/build insurance, cost £25 a year, no problem in my eyes.

We should give the police bigger sticks and a licence to use them  :D

[TimM]

We should give the police bigger sticks and a licence to use them  :D

That may solve many problems  :D