sluggish starting 90

[Matt_H]

I've just got a 90 that had an early 200 tdi fitted into it.  When starting from cold in the morning it needs a little throttle then about 20 seconds before anything really starts to want to happen.

I popped into safari today and asked if they could take a look when it's next in, but they said.. "ahhh early defender 200 tdi, yes sir they all do that to some extent.. discos didn't no idea why!"  

Also idlying when really cold it sounds more like a bus (lumpy), once warm it's fine and purrs away nicely

so, is it normal?  is there anything that can be done? should I just shut up?

Thanks people!
Matthew

[Jim-Willy]

my 300tdi started lovely until the winter came (don't know whether its the cold or my deep wading :oops: ), now in the cold mornings it needs a lot of cranking (10-20 seconds) before it fires but is then fine for the rest of the day.  Always does start though so i aren't worrying too much.

[Matt_H]

300s much better and my 200 tdi disco started within a second all the time.. but this one.. hmmmmm.  I've not had any other early 200 tdi defenders to compare to.  (mine was td now tdi)

M

[robbie]

our 2.5 N/A sounds like a bag of spanners when it is cold, but fine once warmed up. I reckon we might have the wrong oil in it and will go for something alittle thicker next change

As for the stgarting, could it be the heaters?? I am no expert but they do have to be good on all cylinders before it will go

[Matt_H]

glow plugs were replaced by the last guy (prolly for the same reason)!  However the td you had to hold the key round for the glow plugs to warm up - I give it about 15 seconds and that seems to be ok.  The disco didnt really need any glow plugs even when really cold.  I've checked voltage at glow plugs and that seems fine, either way it's still ropey for the first 20 seconds or so.

I trust safari but wondered what other peoples experience was. Was there  a cure?

Matthew

[Porny]

Glowplugs shouldn't really be needed on a 200Tdi unless it's really cold....

Few things that can affect starting:

Incorrect engine timing... has a new cam belt been fitted recently???  Might be worth checking that the timing marks line up, as even a few mm makes quite a difference... if in doubt fit a new cam belt and set it up correctly!!!

Valve clearances... have these been checked?? If the gap's too small, the car will struggle to start.

Lift pump.... check that the fuel filter is filled to the brim (though depends which filter is fitted as has had an engine conversion).  Poor starting is another sign that the lift pumps started to fail.


Also, have you checked the fuel filter and air filter, both may need changing?



Ian

P.s. will reply to your pm later.... need to check a few things

[Matt_H]

thanks for the list, I'll ask safari to check everything over, when they do the x-member I've asked them to do the timing belt too.  thing is once warm it goes really well, it's just when cold!

is there a cold start micture or something?  I remember the disco when it had it's pump rebuilt by the lucaas chap - he said that you normally get black smoke on startup as it puts more fuel in at that time.. I get some smoke but not a black puff as far as I can tell, so maybe it could be something as simple as that?

Matthew

[timberdog]

Since fitting a 200 TDI i  have never used Glow Plugs to start she fires first time every time...touch wood

[Matt_H]

Since fitting a 200 TDI i  have never used Glow Plugs to start she fires first time every time...touch wood

Which tdi did you fit?  defender or discovery?

Matthew

[Porny]

Timberdog has got a Disco 200Tdi in his 90".....


Ian

[Dirty Gertie]

On a cold start, I always wait til the glow plug light goes out, but she starts with no throttle at all!

[Matt_H]

my glow plug light doesn't seem to go out, but you have to hold it in position 3 for it to work (friends earlt TD is the same I think), then when you start and release it goes back to position 2.

I hope this turns into an easy fix  :o

[Porny]

Matt....

The glowplug set up on your 200Tdi is wired up the same as the NA diesel and the 2.5Td.

Factory 200Tdi and 300Tdi's have a glowplug timer, but most people, when they convert a non-Tdi to a Tdi just use the same wiring.... which means you have to hold the key to keep the glow plugs on (also means you control how long they are on for!!)

This is how I wired my Tdi up when I converted from a Td... the glowplug really is just something else to go wrong in my opinion (and isn't that cheap)... plus I didn't see the point.

Ian

[Matt_H]

aha, thoguht as much my friends converted one is the same.. but as everyone says they really dont normally need glow plugs..

The battery was  abit lazy this morning and after about 5 attempts to start didnt have enough puff so I used one of the discos old batteries to jump start her.  Once I get the seats changed over I'll put the twin battery setup in anyway.

I'm hoping its something simple like the timing being a little out, and nothing as series like james with a nackered timing pully/crank!  Let's hope safari can sort it all out :-)

Matthew

[muddyjames]

How is it now as I saw you flying past me this morning. Was it just the timing being way out?

Are you free on Saturday to do my snorkel? PLEEEEASE (on my knees here) I am going off roading on sunday n would like the snorkel on.

[Bush Tucker Man]

Both 300Tdi's I've had (110 & the Disovery) both started perfectly in cold weather
The 110 did get a new battery at one point, it started, but the alarm kept going off as it was sensing a low voltage (as though it was being drained as some 'scrote' had opened a door)

The Discovery was still on original battery (as far as I knew), after 110,000miles & 71/2years.

[Matt_H]

timing was out - looks like the lift pump was nadged, also may have a leak from one of the diesel lines - I'm sure I can hear air if I pump the handle and have the solenoid switched on... started second time this am which will do me for now :-)

Just got to figure out how to change this washer jet now!

Matthew