This weekend I 'av been mostly fitting.... my new suspension

[Porny]

And I must say I'm very impressed!!!!

Standard strings (so no suspension lift!!)

This is the 'weekender' kits so comes with:

New procomp dampers (all 4)
New front damper mounts (external, rather than inside of the spring)
New rear damper mounts
HD front Turrets
Extended brake lines
Extended bump stops

And then to add to this (the next stage up  :D )

QT Front radius arms (-3 Deg in this case)
QT Rear Trailing arms
Full Red Polybush Kit
And a few other bits and pieces!!!


Being standard height (and thus standard rate springs) my 90 still handles very well (even better with the polybush set and uprated dampers) and still tows without any problems!!!

The -3 Deg front arms are usually only fitted to correct a 2" suspension lift, but on standard height they make quite a difference to the suspension and the way it self centres!!

This kit has also changed my mine about the 'do dislocation cones work/is there any point' debate.   IMHO with the correct kit ..... YES they do work, and make a difference!!!  
There is no way that a Land Rover on completely standard suspension would have got up the ramps!!! Or up the bank shown in the photo's without at least one locking diff.




Ian

[Porny]

And a few more.... just testing pics!!   (supension not at max)

The first pic shows max articulation with completely standard suspension as a comparison.

[colintandy]

:D like it like it like it got any pics off the front end intrested in doin same to disco but with a 3 link set up and your dead right there is no debate wheels on ground =traction and control :Das you can see still not taken up high enough as the spring has not dislocated yet i cant get high enough safley in garden but still got loads travel left  :D

[Xtremeteam]

how much was the shocks,mounts & cones?

[Porny]

Colin.....
You need a proper ramp!!   ..


Mike - best bet would be to either email/pm Andy - landy_andy on here or have a look at www.paidia4x4.com (run by Mud_Club members!!)...



Ian

[Porny]

Colin.... just for you....

Front suspension photo.

It's a different set-up to the three link front end though... the weekender kit uses a different damper mount as it's designed to be 'bolt-on' - so no mods.  The three link kit needs the inner arch trimmed.


Ian

[rollazuki]

Looks nice n flexy, bet yr neighbours think yr a bit nuts now tho with the big ramp out on the green :lol:

looks tidytho, nice front mounts.






Get that 3 link in the front now.lol

[colintandy]

:Di have got a ramp to use just wont fit in me garden lol ..like that front set up what length shockers you using

[tim-green]

:D Looks Good

[stratie]

Looking good ian  
Why did you stick with the standard springs?

[Porny]

:Di have got a ramp to use just wont fit in me garden lol ..like that front set up what length shockers you using

Not sure what length front shocks, came as part of the weekender kit.... which was designed by Andy at www.whitepeakengineering.com

Looks Good

Cheers Tim

Looking good ian  
Why did you stick with the standard springs?

Because I'm not a great fan of lifted suspension... unless for a specific reason.

In my case I'm only running standard size tyres, and I'm more than happy with standard Land Rover spring lengths and rates (Land Rover spend a lot more than any aftermarket company developing springs!!)... and with the kit fitted I've got more than enough suspension travel.

Higher suspension would raise my CoG, increase the working angles of my prop shafts and in all honesty would not allow me to gain that much in regards to ramp break over angle (would be slightly different if a 110 or Disco) or approach and departure angles.

If I wanted to, with the weekender kit, it would be easy to change to lifted spring set up as I already have extended brake lines - and I took the option of a set of caster corrected radius amrs, and 'bent' rear trailing arms.  It is something I might try in the future, but at the moment I'm more than happy!!

The only thing I loose out on is distance between the bump stop and the axle (at the front).... the kit uses longer bump stops (as the closed length of the damper is longer than a standard damper)... but we are only taking about 15mm less, and I don't see this as being a problem...  a set of longer springs would put things back to normal... but at the moment it works ok as it is.



Ian

[J B]

that looks great, and makes a lot of sense, enjoy the articulation 8)

[mud-club-matty]

nice one mate i wana one

[landy_andy]

:D like it like it like it got any pics off the front end intrested in doin same to disco but with a 3 link set up and your dead right there is no debate wheels on ground =traction and control :Das you can see still not taken up high enough as the spring has not dislocated yet i cant get high enough safley in garden but still got loads travel left  :D

Hi,

If your interested in 3Link then come and talk to me. There is a intersting thread here : http://landroversonly.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7627 where my kit was being 'discussed'.

Ian..... your cheque's in the post mate  

Cheers,

[beast5680]

i like the look of that kit and from what have seen its reasonably priced as well, its something i,ve been thinking about fitting to my disco if i ever get the steering sorted out and get it back thru the mot :lol:

[Popeye]

That looks great Porny  8)

[timberdog]

pory got the link to the suspension set package ??

looks sweet 8)

[davidlandy]

looks well smart Ian

a well sorted package
 :D

[Range Rover Blues]

How tall is your ramp? this is the biggest thing I could find to drive onto round here.

[Bulli]

Looking good, have you lowered the bump stops? If they are the 12inch procomps you may fin they top out unless you lower it quite a bit ..especially as you havent lifted it.
Get yourself in the rock crawl at Frickley....who needs ramps when mother nature is so kind.

[mark.yellow.series.3]

people who crawl rocks are nutters,

to insane for me. :lol:  :lol:

[Porny]

porny got the link to the suspension set package ??

looks sweet 8)

Have a look at www.paidia4x4.com or pm andy-landy on here or via www.whitepeakengineering.com

How tall is your ramp? this is the biggest thing I could find to drive onto round here.

Not my ramps, but there are about 24" with the wood underneath.

Looking good, have you lowered the bump stops? If they are the 12inch procomps you may fin they top out unless you lower it quite a bit ..especially as you havent lifted it.

Not sure what length Procomps they are.... but:

At the moment, the rears bottom out at the same time.... the axle is pressed up onto the bump stop just before/at the same point as the damper is completely compressed (i.e. perfectly matched).

The front though, currently bottoms out on the dampers before the bump stops.... this will change once I've fitted the extended versions.

I'm not sure what you mean by

especially as you havent lifted it.

The force to get a spring 'fully' compressed is very large, and as such you would need to have a large impact to bottom the shock out to the extent that the axle is on the bump stop.  Not the sort of thing you'd see at low speed off roading (different if high speed CCV type use)

Without the spring in place, as mentioned, the axle hits the bump stop at the time that the damper is fully compressed - as it is designed to do.
(the front will be the same once I've fitted the extended bump stops)

But even in the photographs, with the wheel pushed up inside of the arch... the damper is not fully compressed, and still has an inch and a bit  of travel left, but you are fighting against the loading/compressed length of the spring.  
And a spring that is longer or of a higher loading (which is what people fit when they fit +2" springs) would only make matters worse.

The only way around this would be to run softer springs, shorter springs and/or ones with less coils... which could possibly cause more problems than they'd solve.

[clbarclay]

When in use bumpstops will compress, so the axle should hit the bumpstop before the damper is fully compressed or most of the force of the impact will end up on the damper, not good.

[Porny]

Depends how soft the bumps stops are, and how far they compress under load.

The ones fitted are uprated, and as such deflect less than standard for a given load.... and thus will not allow a damper to compress any further than it's initial bump stop.

As already mentioned though....

The force to get a spring 'fully' compressed is very large, and as such you would need to have a large impact to bottom the damper and the spring out to the extent that the axle is on the bump stop. Not the sort of thing you'd see at low speed off roading which this kit is designed for!! (different if high speed CCV type use).
The other way would be to overload the vehicle or to drive like an idiot.

Under current usage, I don't believe the current set up would cause any problems.  However, Andy mentioned he's looking at the design of the rear mount, so may adjust it slightly to ensure there is slightly more of a 'fail safe' within the design.

Ian

[Bulli]

Sorry mate i wasnt having a pop, dont know where you get you massive force theory from. My axle hits the bump stops pretty regularily when doing large axle twisters...as for force i think that is supplied by my 2 tonne disco.
The lifted bit refers to the fact that a 12 inch travel procomp is longer than a 10 inch and so on(strange that) . The damper rod has to go somewhere.
So , follow my logic, if you have a 12inch shock as per the normal g2f kit then there is less room for it if you havent lifted your suspension...is that not logical?? Therefore if you dont lift the car but fit the same length shocks as they normally supply for lifted cars you may run into the top of the shock b4 it hits the bump stop.
If this wasnt a problem why would they fit bump stops to everything??? It is there to protect the shock / spring from becoming damaged.

[Porny]

In my case that doesn't happen....

With standard suspension (well standard springs), even fully twisted my axle does not touch the bump stop.  Whether this is due to standard spring compression weights/rates, or the fact my 90 is quite a bit lighter than your Disco,  I don't know.
Either way it doesn't actually matter as 'if' the spring was fully compressed then the axle would hit the bump stops and prevent the damper from being completely bottomed out... as tested without the spring in place.

Regardless of whether I've lifted the suspension or not, spring length doesn't play a part as long as the bump stop length is matched to the closed length of the damper.... which it is.

Without lifted springs, due to the lower bump mount (at the front), I will have less compression of the suspension, but the same amount of droop.
Shock length is also adjusted by the mounting postion, and the Whitepeak Engineering (not G2F any more) uses different mounts to standard, and not just lowers them as per other kits.  Again this dictates bump stop/damper closed position


Ian

[Bulli]

Ian, im fully aware of where the mounts are and the fact that they are higher not lower. The kits that lower the mount do not use as long as shock.
If your bump stop is so well set up why doesnt it stop the axle at full travel. Surely it would if it was perfectly matched as you say??
If it doesnt then is your spring not in danger of becoming coil bound?
The set up look well thought out and its your choice to lift or not im neutral either way.I was just pointing out that as shocks arent free and everyone else on the planet uses bump stops to limit upward travel it seems strange you have decided everyone else is wrong.Paddocks,John Craddock G2f , scorpion, safari gard all supply lowered bump stops .... there must be a reason

[SteveG]

Hi Ian

Well done on the mods, Andy's kit does look good and it would be interesting to see how the relocated shock mounts compare to a 'normal' lowered shock mount arrangement. We'll have to try and meet up to compare. I haven't done anything with f&r radius arms on mine yet so it would be good to compare pre and post this mod on mine to see what difference it makes.

As for lift I agree with not lifting more than you need to, although on mine with 255/85's and a 1.5" lift I need to slightly trim the arches on full articulation.

I agree with Bulli that on any play day site your bump stops are going to be used quite often and it seems like we all know why these have to be set at the right height.

Cheers

Steve :)

[PUX]

looking really good porny, 8)  they dont do that kit to fit the disco do they, i have looked and can only see that it fits defender :?

[rollazuki]

Porny, summat for ya to think about.

If you take the springs out, then sit the chassis/axle on the bump stops, and the shocks just top out then the first time you take a heavy hit and the bump stops compress, then youll damage something(shox/mounts)

But, if you look at the setup, theshock(I think) is mounted outboard on the landy axle, further out from the bump stop. This means that if you flex one side fully, the shock will top out long before the bump stop even meets.
Take the springs out and cycle the suspension each side and check, saves repairs later.