Supercharger on a classic

[SebastianW]

I had the idea of sticking a supercharger on a RRC (possibly a Roots supercharger?)
Am I a nieve fool for thinking this up, or is it actually a good idea?

Seb

[AbyssDJ]

probably a naive fool ;)

[Bobtail]

I had the idea of sticking a supercharger on a RRC (possibly a Roots supercharger?)
Am I a nieve fool for thinking this up, or is it actually a good idea?

Seb

VERY GOOD IDEA =P~

[Guardian.]

seen quite a few done up at mates garage, they go like stink. i wouldnt be stickin it on and old engine though.

[SebastianW]

seen quite a few done up at mates garage, they go like stink. i wouldnt be stickin it on and old engine though.

I was thinking a 3.9EFi.
What do you mean by new? I'm hoping 90'-92' ish.

seb

[simdeb]

Had a rangey that came with a factory fitted supercharger never had it running its a  few years back sold the motor as spares .

[SebastianW]

Did any of the Range/Land Rover 3.9 V8s ever come with a supercharger?

seb

[Range Rover Blues]

Seen one turbocharged.  I'd think the biggest problems with blowing an EFi would be

Compression ratio needs lowering to prevent runaway knock (dieseling).
Standard ECU wouldn't run with that much air going through it
Fuel pressure regulator is not designed for that much pressure

But in theory it's do-able.

[SebastianW]

Damn RRB, you dont half know your stuff! :lol:

Well changing the compression ratio isn't that difficult is it?
Would I have to buy a new, compatible ECU, or could the original one be remapped? I have a feeling ECUs could be expensive.
Could the fuel regulator be altered, or would a new one be in order? And do they command a premium?


seb

[Range Rover Blues]

You have many options on the EFi front, one being a megasquirt kit.  Build it yoursefl and pregram it from a laptop.  A bit overkill for a N/A V8 but perhaps right up your street if you are turbocharging.

Don't know about the fuel reg, the Lucas system runs at IIRC 27PSI (could be way off) but I know it's lower than most other modern EFi systems, so you would need an adjustable regulator of some sort but I'm sure they are available, you aren't the first person to hatch this plan :)

Lowering the C:R, firstly there is the low compression engine, then there's thicker head gaskets.  In an article I was reading in Classic Ford folks even use sandwich plates on blown Pintos to get the C:R down.

[SebastianW]

OK, thanks for the input.

Firstly, what about changing engines.
I've always adored the 'american muscle' sound (something like what the group of thugs drive when they do the street race half way through 2 Fast 2 Furious). Would it be pleasable to plonk something like that under the hood, and then boost it? (I dont know of any example engines, so if you want an example, you'll have to suggest one   )

Secondly, I'm guessing a megasquirt kit is a form of fuel injection, but how does it differ to traditional EFi?


seb

[jay118]

I think you'll need to uprate your brakes to if you want to stop , sounds like this could be a fast RR . LOL :)

[Range Rover Blues]

I was reading a brill article just the other day about a TVR that had had the Rover derived V8 replaced with a brand new Yank lump from one of the big 3, would that be a Camero :?:  definitely not a Ford.

Expensive though, total build came out at £15,000

But then there's always the 5.7 litre overfinch, provided you have shares in Texaco, and they can be found in quite humble Yank panel vans.

Personally I'd love to drive an overfinch but I find I can't actually use the power I'd got on the LSE anyway.

[SebastianW]

Expensive though, total build came out at £15,000.

 :shock:  WHAT?! not all engine transplants are that expensive, surely!

But then there's always the 5.7 litre overfinch, provided you have shares in Texaco, and they can be found in quite humble Yank panel vans.

I dont really want an engine much bigger than 4L. Reasons being; Insurance prices, fuel consumption and with a charger it may be too powerful for the gear and transfer boxes and may tear them to shreads.

Personally I'd love to drive an overfinch but I find I can't actually use the power I'd got on the LSE anyway.

I too will probably not utilise the power alot of the time, but when faced with a red light and a mates saxo next to me, I want him trailing in my dust, and not the other way round. If you know what I mean. :lol:

I think you'll need to uprate your brakes to if you want to stop , sounds like this could be a fast RR . LOL :)

Yes. Stopping may be a problem. Looks like my next few days will be filled with researching performance RR brakes.

I looked at MegaSquirt kits, and I quite like them. I think I'll br considering that.

I looked at insurance quotes for a 3.9EFi non-altered RRC, and was unpleasently surprised. I'd looked at 3.9EFi defenders previously, and thought the price would be somewhat similar, but.....no. At £2400/yr, I think I'll be waiting untill I have a nice NCB before I modify my RR in anyway that may affect the insurance.
Or I dont tell them  

[Range Rover Blues]

Your best bet for a quick car is shed some weight.  If you want it quick off the mark then dropping the hearing might be in order, like a Defender T-Box or 3.77 diffs rather than 3.54.

But mostly the weight.

I also find the auto better for quick gettaways.

on  standard car you can get away with a k&n panel filter in the airbox (or drum) and a sports pipe, though I find the later doesn't do enough to justify the cost.  IIRC the TDi centre box is straight through, so stick one of those in you exhaust and do away with the back box.  Other than that keep the 3.9 exhaust as it's not that bad TBH, unless like mine it's forever falling apart.

Brake upgrades, I'm looking at EBC disks and pads from Paddocks, £100 plus the dreaded :)

[SebastianW]

Changing the gearing would be a good option, but I want to keep the top speed. So are overdrives available for Rangies? If so then I probably will change the gearing.

What are Paddocks own performance discs like in comparison to EBCs?

What weight reductions can you do on a range rover? Bearing in mind I dont want it looking like a rally car at the end of it.  :lol:


seb

[Range Rover Blues]

Don't know about the Paddocks disks but the EBCs are cheap anough for me.

Saving weight Hmm.

Ok, the seats weigh 23Kg each if they are electric, so buckets perhaps and bin the back one?

Sound insulation, nearly 200Kg of it crept into the RRC during it's life span.

Drive a 2 door

QT front arms will save about 8kg IIRC and help with handling

Tidy out your boot

Run on road tyres unless you need muds that day

leave the spare at home

clean out the chassis with a jet-wash (attachment for doing drains) and steam clean the engine/gearbox

I think an aluminium diff housing would be a good idea, but no-one makes them as yet.

Glass is always heavy

Then there is the steel superstructure of the car, much of which is not doing much

GRP bonnet and boot (doors if you can find them) and an ali tailgate

etc etc

[SebastianW]

OK, thanks.

Sound insulation, nearly 200Kg of it crept into the RRC during it's life span.

What do you mean by that?

2 doors are out of the question. I hate the hassle of getting people in the back!  :roll:

By GRP, you mean glass reinforced plastic right?


seb

[Range Rover Blues]

If you look at the factory kerbweight of an early 4 door EFI and look at the weight of the same car by about 1993 you will notice it's about 200KG heavier.

Mostly this is due to the extra sound insulation under all the carpets, along the firewall and under the bonnet.

Some of it is due to the extra toys, but no much.  Air conn adds a few Kg too so if you never use it........

The 2 extra doors also contribute to around 25KG IIRC and the soft dash cars had side impact bars, making them even heavier still.

Yes, GRP is glass reinforced plastic (or polyester).

[SebastianW]

OK, I might consider getting lighter doors, to contribute for the extra 2 of them (if they're not too expensive).

But 200Kg on sound proofing? :shock: They really must have stuffed it in there!


On a slightly different subject, how much power do these V8s typically loose in 18 years?


seb

[Range Rover Blues]

Yeah I could hardly believe the 200KG either but it's the only major difference between the early EFi and later cars.  It's inside the doors and the roof too probably, the black stick on stuff they call dead sheet.

Unbless of course they started to use thicker metal :?

As for power loss I'd have to say a fair bit.  Add to that some 3.9s were ok, some were very quick and just occasionally you found a slow one.

Wear in the camshaft can, I'm told, rob both power and economy.  Wear in the timing chain will also effect the engine.

[SebastianW]

So basically, if I find i have a really weak 3.9EFi, I should take a look at the cam shafts and timing chains?


seb

[Range Rover Blues]

As long as a compression test shows no problems and it's not using water (a bit of oil is ok) then it might be worth a look at the cam yes.

Have a mooch round the RPI website for more detail on what cams do and why they wear etc.