Detroit true track

[lambert]

Anyone used them? Are they any more effective than a normal slip diff?

[UKJeeper]

Yes i have, and yes they are. I had one in my front axle with a Detroit in the back. Worked very well.

[Eeyore]

Good question, but lets reprase it a mo. Technically the company is Tractech
The Detroit is the autolocker
The Tru-trac is the limited slip jobby

I know is sounds pedantic, but the two units do a very different job - which depending on what you're wanting to do will change which one you may want. Clarifying it at the start also means that we'll know which unit subsequent answers refer too!  :lol:

Anyhoo, to kick off Henry Webster has a Tru-trac in the back of his racer and loves it (so much so that Wolife wants one in the back of his!)
If memory serves, Trasher has had expereince of the Detroit.

Cheers
 8)
Eeyore

[Niel]

Anyone used them? Are they any more effective than a normal slip diff?

I'd e-mail matt@rangie.com for some insight, I've got one of his units that locked up and wouldn't unlock under the bench....But yes they do work well.

[lambert]

As it stands my rear diff is standard friction type and it is not bad except in real bad twisters. The front is open.
 
I do all sorts of terrain from lanes to tree infested swamp.
 
What i've seen is a slip diff that works on worm gears? And locks tighter than a friction? :?
 
What i'm wanting is to put one of these into each end.
 
I prefer slippers to air lockers as it's one less thing to forget to do in time to avoid getting stuck.

[Thrasher]

I've got tru-tracs front and rear in Piglet. Love 'em.

Datalas is currently driving him at the moment, and I'm pretty sure he'll have not noticed anything that gives away the fact they are there on road. However at the Billing Bash he tootled through the mud-run without issue.....

[extreme90]

I prefer slippers to air lockers as it's one less thing to forget to do in time to avoid getting stuck.

you need practice your ground reading skills then    
you need to know when to use lockers and when not to
i never have forgotten to use my lockers, i select when i feel the need to use them
some instances, they will get u stuck where as before you wouldnt  

o, detroit lockers are useless IMO, many people will agree also
then there will be a few that disagree,
air lockers for me,
dan

[Thrasher]

Let's make sure we all know what's going on here :

Detroit LOCKERS are not Detroit/Tractech tru-tracs.

Detroit lockers are horrible auto-lockers - not LSD etc.

[extreme90]

Let's make sure we all know what's going on here :

Detroit LOCKERS are not Detroit/Tractech tru-tracs.

Detroit lockers are horrible auto-lockers - not LSD etc.

ino neil    im simply making a point about the " fit and forget "

and detoit lockers aint auto lockers
they are un-lockers to clear that up as many people dont get that  :?
dan  8)

[clbarclay]

The differeance between a truetrac is a geared torque biasing diff and typical LSD are an open diff with friction plates connecting the input to the both outputs.

In practice a torque biasing diff can generate more trust than a friction LSD, but need resistance to both wheels to work, which is why you need left foot braking when one wheel starts to spin to get the best out of a truetrac. The limiting factor to friction LSD is that if the pre set friction is too high then it would be like driving with a locked diff thats permenantly engaged.


There is a time and a place for friction LSD, torque biasing and manual locking diffs off road. For high speed driving like racer that Eeyore described then a manual locking diff like an ARB would be of limited use being unable to react quick enough.

[thermidorthelobster]

If memory serves, Trasher has had expereince of the Detroit.

Is that a Freudian slip?

[lambert]

So what we are saying is that for general fit and forget use a pair of friction slip diffs  will be on top of most situations?

and for when they aint get a rope!

[barny]

I'm lost  :oops:

[Range Rover Blues]

True trac types, the Auto Torque Biasing are also popular on track day cars due to being less severe than friction type LSDs, as the later can be too severe.  Steer with the throttle anyone?

What I dislike about the Detroit Locker is that effectively it is a locked up dif with no planet gears, rather it has a freewheel mechanism that needs grip in both wheels to 'unlock' the faster-moving wheel.  So in a turn on highway the outside wheel is no-longer driving.  This will induce some understeer and explains why Detroit Lockers CANNOT be used in the front axle.  On a vehicle with an LSD or viscous centre diff the increased differnence in axle speeds may also cause problems.

For me it has to be ARB air lockers.  There whne you want, not there when you don't.  Switchable even when driving, positive, reliable.

There are situations when having a locked up diff makes thing worse and a Detroit locker doesn't give you the choice.

[clbarclay]

So what we are saying is that for general fit and forget use a pair of friction slip diffs  will be on top of most situations?

and for when they aint get a rope!

Generally...
Friction LSDs are the best for fit and forgeting (which is why a lot of manufactures use them), a true trac (with left foot braking) will generally go further and a manual locking diff takes the most effort from the driver, but will go the furthest.

As for being on top of most situations, over 90% of the time an open diff with a little momentum is enough in my experiance, but then for some people that 10% of the time is much more important.

[extreme90]

So what we are saying is that for general fit and forget use a pair of friction slip diffs  will be on top of most situations?

and for when they aint get a rope!

Generally...
Friction LSDs are the best for fit and forgeting (which is why a lot of manufactures use them), a true trac (with left foot braking) will generally go further and a manual locking diff takes the most effort from the driver, but will go the furthest.

As for being on top of most situations, over 90% of the time an open diff with a little momentum is enough in my experiance, but then for some people that 10% of the time is much more important.

IMO the best benifit of the lockers is your not going to bust a diff when winching    

they by no means help in mudruns ect ect, as momentom is what you need

best place for lockers is on rocks and very uneven but firm ground

but what i dont get is, if you've already got a factory fitted lsd diff, why not just leave it in instead of messing, spend the money on some other mod that'll be worth while, like a winch  :roll:

changing the diffs for other lsd's isnt really going to improve the ability of the truck IMO  :?

[lambert]

After all the input i'm leaving back alone and just getting another lsd for the front.

As for why not get a winch the main issue there is needing to have a custom bumper and not having the workshop facilities to build my own. :D

[extreme90]

i aint that familiar with the chassis rails of the maveric.terrano, but im sure a bikini mount wouldnt be hard to fab up
dan

[lambert]

They drop down in front of the axle and as such needs back braces so as not to rip it off. So far the best quote is in the region of 500 notes without a winch! :?

[extreme90]

what mud tyres you running ?
sorry, i just cannot let you spend so much money on something that really isnt going to give you gain without a fight    
wheel spin on the front can be counterbalanced with the break, which is the method ive used on  my 90 for ages, infact i still do to try and stop them spinning even with lockers in

look at other aspects before spending the money, i just feel your going to fit it, then be dissapointed to find your not really getting any further  :(

dan

[lambert]

235/75/15 colway mt on the front. Older style khumo mt on the back but not for long. Will be getting 31/10.5/15 probably either colway mt or macho's as soon as brass is available.

[clbarclay]

but what i dont get is, if you've already got a factory fitted lsd diff, why not just leave it in instead of messing, spend the money on some other mod that'll be worth while, like a winch  :roll:

Depends on the vehicle in question, but on some toyotas you can improve the benefit of the factory LSDs very cheaply by just shimming them? (not sure of the details) to increase the friction as they don't relativerly have much effect as standard.

[extreme90]

235/75/15 colway mt on the front. Older style khumo mt on the back but not for long. Will be getting 31/10.5/15 probably either colway mt or macho's as soon as brass is available.

so spend the money on some macho's that will get you way futher than this lsd will on mud tyres

[lambert]

The taller tyres will be happening regardless.

As for more diff action i'm inclined to find a cross reference to one off some other application that will fit, then try get one from a breakers for cheap money. That is one of the joys of working in bradford is the profusity of dodgy scrap yards! :shock:  :D

[Range Rover Blues]

but what i dont get is, if you've already got a factory fitted lsd diff, why not just leave it in instead of messing, spend the money on some other mod that'll be worth while, like a winch  :roll:

Depends on the vehicle in question, but on some toyotas you can improve the benefit of the factory LSDs very cheaply by just shimming them? (not sure of the details) to increase the friction as they don't relativerly have much effect as standard.

There was an article in joyrider monthly recently about fitting an LSD to a classic ford, but as the magazine was dedicatyed to going everywhere sideways I wasn't that impressed.

Aparently LSDs have a pre-load spring to give an initial amount of lock-up and a set of cams on the diff-pin to lock up fully under load.  These 2 aspects are tuneable to taste.

Having driven a 2.8Injection special Capri, with factory LSD I'm not a fan.  It's simply a choice between spinning one wheel at the traffic light grand prix and not moving very fast, or spinning both wheels and ending up facing the direction you came from.  If Julie's needs an LSD (which I doubt) I'll save up for a ATB.

[jjsaul]

I've got tru-tracs front and rear in Piglet. Love 'em.

I've got tru-tracs front and rear in my RRC as well, running insa turbo special track tyres (265/75R16).

I find the whole lot a great combo, got me through / up / over stuff where 90's were struggling (on similar tyres) even though i was dragging the back end a bit.
Left foot braking helps at times.