Roof lights

[morson4x4]

Any1 know the laws on roof lights regards to linking them to main beam or does it have to be on a switch and how does it effect on the MOT does it have to be on a switch etc thanks

[Disco Matt]

Nobody seems to be entirely sure! I have read that they're ok providing that you don't have more than six lights (so two headlights and up to four driving lights) and that they're under 60w each. I doubt you'd get any hassle so long as you weren't being an idiot with them. Go around built up areas with them on, or blinding oncoming traffic, and you'll get pulled over. Use them respectfully and you're not likely to have any bother.

I've wired mine via a switch and make sure they're not in circuit come MOT time. No problems as yet.

[Range Rover Blues]

Not heard the one about placement behind the front axle, thanks Saffy.

I do know the limit is 6 lights on at once (you can fit what you like) mounted symetrically which I think menas even numbers unlike the Italian Job Minis and no more than 99 watts each I read somewhere.

[morson4x4]

thats cool ill plonk arelay switch in and have it on switch and on main beam i have a illuminating swith so i will be easily indicated they are on, its a strange law its like cricket its our sport and no1 knows how the rules work  :doh:

[dxmedia]

 :oops: :oops: 6 at once?  oops I've 1/2 a K of light up front on the main beam switch  :lol: Might have to fit an isolator then.

[Landy1uk]

I've got Driving lights up top in centre and fogs either side on seperate switches + relays used the Disco 1 switchesthat go in casing where the coin tray in a D2 is they light up aswell. none are wired to the main beam would now which wire to splice  in to

[topless matt]

The wire to splice into is the blue and orange wire iirc.  Just have a look in a haynes manual and it will tell you, ou only use the wire to feed a relay that will power the lights up anyway.

[TBM]

As far as I'm aware, the axle thing is an urban myth that has found it's way into forums, LR magazines and even police cars.......

Here is the official documentation about Optional Main Beam lamps:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/schedule/5/made

They must extinguish when you select Dipped Beam, and they must be adjustable when the vehicle is stationary. There are no regulations regarding vertical or longitudinal fitting. It expressly states this in the legislation.

I would suggest that you carry around a copy of the legislation, as unfortunately some Police Officers have been caught up in the myth!

[Llanigraham]

Sorry TBM, that legislation is for MAIN BEAM HEADLIGHTS, what is being referred to is additional  AUXILLARY LIGHTS.

They seem to be covered by this:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/schedule/2/made

Item 2 : c

[TBM]

Sorry TBM, that legislation is for MAIN BEAM HEADLIGHTS, what is being referred to is additional  AUXILLARY LIGHTS.

They seem to be covered by this:

http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1989/1796/schedule/2/made

Item 2 : c

Sorry Llanigraham, but I'm referring to 'Optional Main Beam Headlights' as in 'lights that come on with main beam'. In the legislation I quote, it says in PART II that any number can be fitted as long as they comply with section 7, 10 and 12.

The original post also mentioned lights linked to main beam, not auxiliary lights.

On further inspection, the legislation you quote refers to obligatory and optional front position lights. These are what we commonly refer to as sidelights.

[Llanigraham]

And isn't this where it is just too flipping complicated?
You might be right! However that Section I've quoted WILL apply to any lights with the LED fairy ring, as those are positional.

Any other lights that come on with main beam headlights thereby become optional head lights, but I know I have seen a link somewhere to legislation about those.

I wonder why they are being fitted?
Do they really improve the view of the road that much (I'm not meaning Off road use)?
Is it just a fashion statement?
I understand the use in high dust/desert type areas where you want light out of the dust, but driving along the A470 through Mid Wales, or even over the Abergwesyn Pass?
Strange how rally drivers in Forests don't find they need them!

[Disco Matt]

I just need to make a visor for the underside of mine, as at the moment they tend to reflect off the bonnet, wipers, dashboard...  :lol:

Will try prototyping something in cardboard and then making it in polycarbonate I think, that way I can easily cut and smooth it at home and bend it with a heat gun/big lump of wood as an edge. Thinking something similar to the external sun visors fitted to some Series LRs.

[TBM]

And isn't this where it is just too flipping complicated?

I think all the mis information has made it complicated.

Any other lights that come on with main beam headlights thereby become optional head lights, but I know I have seen a link somewhere to legislation about those.

There are no such thing as 'headlights' in the stat regs.

There are:
Schedule 2:  Front position lights (sidelights)
Schedule 3: Dim Dip/Running Lights
Schedule 4: Dipped Beam Lamps (and optional Dipped Beam)
Schedule 5: Main Beam Lamps (and optional Main Beam)

All the regs required are included in the link I gave.
The other Schedules cover rear lights, side markers and fog lights etc

I wonder why they are being fitted?

cos they can :) ;)

[Llanigraham]

cos they can :) ;)

I think they'd look bloody silly on my Yet!! :roll:

[TBM]

You might be right! However that Section I've quoted WILL apply to any lights with the LED fairy ring, as those are positional.

Depends on the intensity. If the output is  lower than 800 candelas then they are classed as optional running lamps and there are no regulation requirements (see SCHEDULE 3). This is how Trucks get away with the dim lit roof lights, and numerous other front facing lights.

[Disco Matt]

cos they can :) ;)

I think they'd look bloody silly on my Yet!! :roll:

Depends on the vehicle, I think they look good on a Disco providing the light bar is neatly made. The problem comes when they're not so much made as bashed together from assorted bits of steel with a welder...

[Range Rover Blues]

What lets many down is they fit those cheapo RIng fog lights, well they aren't any use as fog lights and very little better on the roof.  Gte some really secent lights up there and it;s a different story.  If I ever get mine fitted I have JCB roof worklights to go up there.

[TBM]

What lets many down is they fit those cheapo RIng fog lights, well they aren't any use as fog lights and very little better on the roof.  Gte some really secent lights up there and it;s a different story.  If I ever get mine fitted I have JCB roof worklights to go up there.

This is were the problem starts - if you fit Ring Fog Lights on your roof then you are contravening SCHEDULE 6 - fog lights can't be more than 1200mm above the ground. However, if you fit the Ring Driving Lights, then you're OK.

Sorry to sound so anal about this but I got so sick and fed up with people repeating the 'axle' myth that I spent some considerable time going through all the legislation!

The big issue with Roof Lights is in the set up. So many are set up badly, and use the wrong type of lamp that it gives the others a bad name. It's like the 'I've got a crap tattoo so all tattoos are crap' mentality. Set up and positioned properly, they can provide a decent and useful spread of light, far in excess of normal headlamps.

[Disco Matt]

My day job is as a theatre techie, so I can safely say that the lights supplied with most bars are dire! They're usually intended to be worklights with something that isn't so much a beam pattern as light coming out of the glass bit.

What you actually need is something with a Fresnel lens to give a powerful beam and barn doors to keep the light off the bonnet. Unfortunately nobody seems to make such a thing.

[TBM]

What you actually need is something with a Fresnel lens to give a powerful beam and barn doors to keep the light off the bonnet. Unfortunately nobody seems to make such a thing.

Most cheaper aftermarket driving lamps (even Ring) have a fresnel lens. The more expensive/modern driving lamps use Projector (polyellipsoidal) technology in the reflector to do the same job. 

Barn doors would be a reasonable idea, someone earlier suggested a visor for underneath which would have the same effect.

[pippy0]

I just need to make a visor for the underside of mine, as at the moment they tend to reflect off the bonnet, wipers, dashboard...  :lol:

Ive just started the process of making up such articles... Fitting roof lights to the freelander proved completely pointless without them! Switch them on and you only blind yourself! -angle of the windscreen means the light bounces off it, off the dash etc etc.. Useless.
So far i've changed the roof lights to smaller versions + made some temporary guards to go underneath... Blocked 95% of the light entering the cabin , just need to re-work the design to block the rest.

Ok so like i said, they are in the design stages so not at all pretty.. but very functional!

[Disco Matt]

I'm currently thinking in terms of making plastic U-shaped things which will use the same fixings as the lights. I remember working with polycarbonate-type stuff at school many years ago which was dead easy to handle (even with the rudimentary hand tools they were willing to let Year 8 loose with!). Armed with a jigsaw to cut the parts out and a heat gun to warm the stuff I should be able to bend it fairly accurately to fit around the lamp.

[tack43]

Has anyone tried X-lites? They appear to have covered all the problems if their website is to be believed!

Rich

[Disco Matt]

I've looked at them, but I can't believe the hoods on them are really long enough. I'm keeping my eyes open for a really good set of rectangular driving lamps which I can kit out with shades.

[lee celtic]

I fitted 4 on the rack I made 2 years ago and have had no problems..

but as said I only use them with respect to other road users and have an isolator switch to seperate them from the main beam .. it also goes the other way so I can use them on there own.... :D

[hairyasswelder]

Yes I have 4 fitted to the usual light bar, cheap and nasty lamps  :oops: :oops:

Mainly for posing, wired to main beam and seperate switch.

Only really any use when up to the bonnet with mud or water. NO use at all on the road,

[disco2 td5]

I have 4 fitted to the roof of the disco2.  2 fog lamps and 2 spot lamps and they are totaly usless on the road but greenlaneing at night but that's only when I use them. But I do think the look good

[Range Rover Blues]

I was trying to make some visors for roof lights but my vac former and mould tool went up in flames in my unit.  It's a good idea though because you would get a huge contrast at the bottom edge of the lit area.