Recovery position....

[defuzz]

quick questions,

lets assume you've come across a car stuck in snow/mud at the roadside, being the generous helpful kind, you offer to tow them out.
Assuming you have suitable tow points front and back, which do you use?  which is better for pulling out, 1st gear or reverse?  SOunds silly I know, I'd have thought first would be obvious but what do I know????


also something else occurs to me, with great big towing points, a landy towing point is much less likely to break than a crappy little car point, which means the likelihood is, if it fails, you'll get a flaying rope/shackle smashing through your windows.  Hardly seems fair when rescuing someone else!!!

[drmike]

Personally I'd probably not tow them out at all as if you damage anything in the process they or their insurer will claim against you. I don't think that there would be anything they could do to stop their insurer claiming against you if they make a claim on their insurance.

Sad isn't it?

Mike

[Jim-Willy]

Use a coat to damp the rope.  I wouldn't tow on a towing eye unless it is an offroad one (Jate ring Etc), use your tow bar.  If your not confident best leave well alone.

[bovaboy]

As the man said, pull em out using your tow bar, if they're so stuck you need rev gear in low box you're just gonna break the weedy little recovery point on a car. Tell them before you tow them that you'll accept no responsibility, if it breaks and they try to make a claim deny all knowledge.

[defuzz]

maybe we need to get a legal disclaimer printed out to get people to sign before being towed!!!!

[Wanderer]

Can you just imagine getting it 3/4 of the way out and their end snaps and drops it back in again causing lots of damage.

I'd be very wary about doing it. I'd have to be happy that their recovery points were fine first.

Ed

[drmike]

I think that you'd find any disclaimer would be ignored by the insurer and probably the courts as well as the indivudual probbaly doesn't have th authority to allow the recovery or something equally daft.

So sad - it's like picking up hitch hikers, I just don't do it any more.

Mike

[thermidorthelobster]

Reverse seems to be lower geared than first on many cars, including my Disco IIRC.

But certainly if you need low box first / reverse you're likely to break something in short order.  I saw a tractor towing a Renault Espace out of a gravel trap in the car park at Le Mans last year (the guy drove in oblivious to the fact that it was the only place in the car park with absolutely nothing on it) and just ripped the towing eye out.  I think they got a fork lift truck after that.

[Xtremeteam]

when we revover cars on rallys as stormin will agree we continually ask the owner/driver/service crew if they are happy with how its being recoverd & also ask them to identify suitably strong points of asttachment,its a fav to pull towing eyes of to show that they are crap & they should be stronger,only if its a light or easy pull do we use 1st/rev,normally just use the winch so its a steady pull,

[Wanderer]

Thinking about it, if you've got a Discovery then reverse would be fine under normal circumstances.
However if you've lifted it and you lose grip and slipping and suddenly regain grip the rear trailing (radius) arms can be liable to bend. They are designed with forward motion in mind and don't like abnormal foces being applied in the opposite direction.

Ask Bev Sooty and a few others.

Ed

[drmike]

If we're talking weaknesses I have always understood reverse gear to be weaker than the others and now I always make sure I am using a forward gear.

I agree with the bloke above who said if you're having to worry about breaking their towing point then don't get involved.

Mike

[Xtremeteam]

Thinking about it, if you've got a Discovery then reverse would be fine under normal circumstances.
However if you've lifted it and you lose grip and slipping and suddenly regain grip the rear trailing (radius) arms can be liable to bend. They are designed with forward motion in mind and don't like abnormal foces being applied in the opposite direction.

Ask Bev Sooty and a few others.

Ed

dont see how that could happen when pulling something backwards,that would only happen if A ur doin somethin stupid & B u give it too much beans & the wheels stops against something

[Xtremeteam]

If we're talking weaknesses I have always understood reverse gear to be weaker than the others and now I always make sure I am using a forward gear.

I agree with the bloke above who said if you're having to worry about breaking their towing point then don't get involved.

Mike

reverse is much softer than any of the forward gears,also if goin forwards u can use the other ratios to spin up the wheels & its easier to see where ur goin aswell

[Wanderer]

Thinking about it, if you've got a Discovery then reverse would be fine under normal circumstances.
However if you've lifted it and you lose grip and slipping and suddenly regain grip the rear trailing (radius) arms can be liable to bend. They are designed with forward motion in mind and don't like abnormal foces being applied in the opposite direction.

Ask Bev Sooty and a few others.

Ed

dont see how that could happen when pulling something backwards,that would only happen if A ur doin somethin stupid & B u give it too much beans & the wheels stops against something

Wasn't that what I said. "normal circumstances" implies abnormal circumstances would be needed.
Also slipping and sudden grip.

Beleive me it doesn't take much to bend a trailing arm when in reverse. Bev wasn't doing much more than walking pace along with sudden grip on an incline.

Ed

[Xtremeteam]

only time ive EVER bent an arm was when my mate decided to strap the 90 down for me n put the starp over it,never ever done 1 even doin trials etc & done some extreme things

[Wanderer]

OK I stand corrected. You can't bend a trailing arm.

Ed

[Xtremeteam]

i no u can bend an arm but if u bend an arm whilst doin light recovery u shouldnt be doin it in the first place cos ur obviously doin somethin which is beyond ur capabilitys,

[rokcrawlin]

i no u can bend an arm but if u bend an arm whilst doin light recovery u shouldnt be doin it in the first place cos ur obviously doin somethin which is beyond ur capabilitys,

if in doubt dont pull them out and never recover a vehicle in reverse as it leaves you open to serious injury and your vehicle too at least if something goes wrong on a forward recovery the rear seats give some protection

[Xtremeteam]

i no u can bend an arm but if u bend an arm whilst doin light recovery u shouldnt be doin it in the first place cos ur obviously doin somethin which is beyond ur capabilitys,

if in doubt dont pull them out and never recover a vehicle in reverse as it leaves you open to serious injury and your vehicle too at least if something goes wrong on a forward recovery the rear seats give some protection

if in dout winch it out!!!!!  been doin rally recovery since 87 & never had a problem

[muddyweb]

I often give people an assist if they are broken down and dangerous, or stuck somewhere.... everything from cars to lorries.

If the recovery needs anything more than HIGH box 1st gear... then it is too complicated to be done without having the proper insurance, etc.

I would never winch a stranger's car out, the only time I ever use low box for road recovery is if it's a bloomin big lorry....

I would say... recover forward with a decent Nylon rope (not a strap).. if you can't do that.. then let someone who gets paid for it come and take the risks.

[Bishops Finger]

Towed a caravanette up a shorthill just in 1st gear and 2wd

[lowey]

Anything difficult leave it to the professionals, they have the liability insurance.

I am happy to tow a stranger a short distance to a place of safety when stranded on tarmac, and that is just about it. Do more ambitious things for mates though.

Ditched cars owned by strangers require to be recovered by specialists.

When we are playing at muddy things with our pals we are playing and we all accept the risks that prevail with our own safety in mind.

Other motorists might not understand if you inadvertantly rip their car apart when pulling it out of a ditch.

I have witnessed a vehicle being lifted out using a telescopic crane lorry  and really heavy duty slinging. Then placing it gently onto the back of a flat bed truck. Not your average winching here. No extra obvious damage as a consequence of recovery. This could be important to preserve evidence for whatever reason. Guess the cost is covered by the insurance.

[Jim-Willy]

I would say... recover forward with a decent Nylon rope (not a strap).. if you can't do that.. then let someone who gets paid for it come and take the risks.

Just out of interest.  Why not a towing strap?

[muddyweb]

For tow recovery I favour a rope over a strap as ropes tend to have a bit more give in them and hence reduce the shock loads on everything.

I tend to use straps as bridles and for winching where elasticity can work against you.

[bovaboy]

Take it my steel rope's not the most forgiving thing to use then?  :?

[muddyweb]

Steel wire should only be used on a winch drum IMHO... and for nothing else.

[bovaboy]

Have to say, think I'm gonna take this advice and go get myself a nice forgiving tow rope for my next off road adventure, one of my Jate rings was certainly a different shape after a recovery from a Nissan Patrol. I think this was due to the fact that there is no give in the steel rope. That and the fact it's really heavy to drag about in the deep mud and you can't double it up on short recoverys.

[Xtremeteam]

Ditched cars owned by strangers require to be recovered by specialists

just a few weeks ago had a 350k ford focus on the end of our winch rope,rekon we've had over a million pounds worth of cars on the end of our winch in all the years doin rally recovery

[muddysteve]

Ditched cars owned by strangers require to be recovered by specialists

just a few weeks ago had a 350k ford focus on the end of our winch rope,rekon we've had over a million pounds worth of cars on the end of our winch in all the years doin rally recovery

must been one hell of a ford focus at 350k !!!!!!!!!!!

[Xtremeteam]

ex works wrc focus but still in full works spec,ex delecour car i think