Mud-club
Vehicle & Technical => Defender => Topic started by: Guy90 on September 14, 2006, 09:35:26
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Need to replace the clutch on the 90 (300TDI). Any tips on how to do it?
Thanks
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Neil thorne is your man he helped with mine. We put a big trolley jack under the gearbox remove all the bolts holding the the thing up there remove the props and from the top remove the gear stick cover, undo the reverse cables. When its all lose you can roll the jack back giving enough room to replace the clutch.
Be warned the gearbox's are very heavy.
In order we did it.
1 gear stick tunnel undo cables and remove sticks
2 props off
3 place a big trolley under the box.
4 all bolts holding the boxs up there.
5 slide back and do the clutch.
If you are not sure ask Neil he is now F1 standard at changing clutch's.
Guy putting a gearbox in mine saturday if you need some practice :wink:
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That sound's about right as we just done one in my Disco, we took the cross member off as is was to tight on the chassis, strapped the box to the jack as well, also only pulled the box back about 9 inches, just enough room to get your hand in there to put the new clutch in,
We put a new fork/arm in aswell just to be on the safe side,
good luck with it.
John.
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I'm doing the one on my 90 at the moment... would have been finished but I was away all weekend.
I'd rather not struggle lying on my back, so I just lift the gearbox out complete.
On mine (and all the other Defenders I've done):
Remove the seats, seat box, transmission tunnel and floor panels. (Mr Grinder and Mr Drill are always handy!!)
Remove the front and rear Propshafts
Remove the gear stick
Remove the clutch slave cylinder – tuck up out of the way (no need to disconnect the pipe work – otherwise you’d need to bleed the clutch too!!)
Put a jack or an axle stand under the front of the engine (or wedge with a piece of wood) as when the gearbox is removed, the engine will tilt forward. (unlike any pre 300Tdi engine that tips backwards when the gearbox is removed - down to engine mount position)
Then loosen all of the flywheel housing/bellhousing bolts
Loosen the gearbox mounts
Then attach and engine crane to the gear box, undo all the remaining bolts and lift out through the passenger door.
This then gives you loads of room to replace the clutch etc.
I'd also advice changing you crankshaft rear seal, as these have a habit of going on 300Tdi... all this means is you need to remove the flywheel too. I wouldn't bother with a Britpart or any other aftermarket seal though, a genuine part one is only slightly more expensive (i.e. by about a fiver) make sure you order the gasket too (or just use some proper RTV sealant). IMHO makes sense to do it whilst everything is apart.
You may also find it worthwhile to get a new set of gearbox mounts, as these have a habit of breaking… again genuine part ones aren’t that much.
Clutch wise…. Personally I’d upgrade to a 130†spec clutch and drive plate. Is a straight swap and is more HD than a standard one….
In the end I went for an AP clutch, which also has a cush drive (an extra set of springs), unlike the Valeo one I took out. Replace the release bearing at the same time! (Should come with the clutch kit)… I’d also get a new spigot bush.
Whilst it’s apart, I’d also replace the clutch operating fork (I went for a genuine one again)… as these have a habit of piercing. I would also weld a washer on the pivot point to make sure it can never brake/pierce.
Make sure you also get a new plastic clip that secures the release bearing to the operating arm.
Then just a case of putting it all back together…
I know that this can be done by just sliding the gearbox back, but if you're not in a rush, and are going to replace all the other bits at the same time, I find it much easier just to lift the gearbox out (can’t do this on a Disco or a Range Rover though!!)
Ian
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it doesnt take as long as a disco :lol:
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i did mine last week on my 200tdi defender. i do it a different way though, i take the whole engine out. it does not take as long as you think. took me 1 day. but i was working almost flat out.
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i did mine last week on my 200tdi defender. i do it a different way though, i take the whole engine out. it does not take as long as you think. took me 1 day. but i was working almost flat out.
That's the way I'd do a Disco or a Range Rover......
Ian
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Ian,
Thanks for that. Myself and Mr Exact Fabrications are going to have a go at it.
I'm very short of time as it has be done by lunchtime Saturday so I guess we'll sliding the gearbox back.
I have got a crankshaft seal just in case (i can see a weep of oil from the wading plug hole).
It appears to be thrust bearings gone.
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Ian,
Thanks for that. Myself and Mr Exact Fabrications are going to have a go at it.
I'm very short of time as it has be done by lunchtime Saturday so I guess we'll sliding the gearbox back.
I have got a crankshaft seal just in case (i can see a weep of oil from the wading plug hole).
It appears to be thrust bearings gone.
If Chris is helping, I'm suprised he hasn't made an all singing all dancing, very bling, gearbox frame to kift the box out with!!! :wink:
You might stuggle for room doing the crank seal if the gear box is just being slid back (less space than doing it on a 200Tdi)... and the flywheel bolts are very tight!!! (and loctited!!)
When I got my box out the other day, it took me and brother 3 hours to have the box on the floor and the flywheel removed... air tools (if my compressor was connected) would have made it quicker!!
Just need to put it back together now, then I'm off to Exact again.
Ian
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Ian,
Thanks for that. Myself and Mr Exact Fabrications are going to have a go at it.
I'm very short of time as it has be done by lunchtime Saturday so I guess we'll sliding the gearbox back.
I have got a crankshaft seal just in case (i can see a weep of oil from the wading plug hole).
It appears to be thrust bearings gone.
If Chris is helping, I'm suprised he hasn't made an all singing all dancing, very bling, gearbox frame to kift the box out with!!! :wink:
You might stuggle for room doing the crank seal if the gear box is just being slid back (less space than doing it on a 200Tdi)... and the flywheel bolts are very tight!!! (and loctited!!)
When I got my box out the other day, it took me and brother 3 hours to have the box on the floor and the flywheel removed... air tools (if my compressor was connected) would have made it quicker!!
Just need to put it back together now, then I'm off to Exact again.
Ian
Ian,
Suspect you are right about seal. Got just in case we can do it.
One advantage of taking it to Chris (apart for the fact he's done a lot of clutches in his time) is that he has air tools and heavy duty trolleys and is indoors.
I would have do it on a slope covered in gravel.
I'm just lining up another trip to Chris to sort a cage. It's very handy as he is equal distance between work and home. I can be there in 5 mins.
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I'm doing the one on my 90 at the moment...
Great guide Ian. I was going to put my 110 into the garage when the time for a new clutch and/or gearbox comes round but I think you've inspired me to tackle the job at home. At least I'll know it's been done properly. I assume you removed the gearbox and transfer box as a single unit and they came out of the passenger door as the steering wheel/column would prevent them being removed via the drivers door?
I'm hoping there'll be some pictures of this job when your updated website appears 8)
Colin
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Now on the 12th hour of changing the clutch :evil: :evil: . The last five hours were spent trying to persuade the gearbox to mate with the engine. No go so far.
We will return to the fray on Monday :evil:
Below is the reason the clutch failed. I've not seen this bodge before Not only is the mechanic who did this inept but also can't weld. I shall be looking though the service history of the car to find out which garage did it so you all know not to go there.
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I've been able to identify who did the above back in 2004.
I can PM anyone who wants to know the name of the Leighton Buzzard based person who did it so you can avoid like the plague.
He has done a lot of work on this 90 which now concerns me quite a bit :evil:
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good to hear from you again Guy!! How's the wheel bearings :evil: :lol: ?
good luck with the clutch, what's the problem with refitting the gearbox? Did you make sure you were supplieg with the right clutch(ie are the splines the same).
keep up the good work
Neil....
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not the dreaded studs again Guy!
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Not sure what the problem is. It will go on the splines but not all the way. we can't see anything obvious. It's the right clutch, all the other parts are correct, everything is lined up as it should and we can get it part way on the studs. Just can't get it that final inch.
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you have turned the engine over on the crank pully to line up the splines ?
ino its silly but its the last inch that the splines are
danny
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you have turned the engine over on the crank pully to line up the splines ?
ino its silly but its the last inch that the splines are
danny
Yep! All lined up but no go. It was a pain to get out as well.
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u cleaned all the plines up
if in doubt with draw b4 you get angry
sit and have a brew ponder what wrong whilst leaning over wings and try agen
usualy works :P
is the clutch deffenately allighned properly ?? it can easily slip
is the engine going in square as they are stubborn little [!Expletive Deleted!], come are worse than others
mines a b***h i can tell you that
and mines inn bits on me work bench at mo coz it died on me :cry: still got refit it yet :cry:
want swap ?? :P
if its the last inch its gonna b
1 splines
2 clutch alighnment
3 engine gearbox going together on the P***
danny
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If it was hard to get out aswell is the spiggot bearing o.k as that will be the last think the gearbox shaft goes into??
I know when i fitted a clutch in my series3 i replaced the spiggot bearing but damaged it so when i went to fit the box it wouldn't go all the way in and i spent ages trying to force it in until i took it out and tried fitting a dummy shaft and that wouldn't go in, which is when i realised what i had done :oops: .
hope this helps and you get sorted soon.....
Neil...
If you get really stook give us a call, you should still have my number mate....
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If it was hard to get out aswell is the spiggot bearing o.k as that will be the last think the gearbox shaft goes into??
I know when i fitted a clutch in my series3 i replaced the spiggot bearing but damaged it so when i went to fit the box it wouldn't go all the way in and i spent ages trying to force it in until i took it out and tried fitting a dummy shaft and that wouldn't go in, which is when i realised what i had done :oops: .
hope this helps and you get sorted soon.....
Neil...
If you get really stook give us a call, you should still have my number mate....
ive done that aswel :shock:
forgot all about the bearing hmmm :?
wounder what mine like
danny
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Another 6 hour session today has got it in. now just some tightning up to do and trim to be replaced and job done.
I have discovered the following:
It's a lot harder doing a clutch on a 300 as compared to a 200.
You must shore up the engine as 300s tilt the other way to 200s making it very difficult to line up.
Changing a clutch is not a one man job.
What a grand way to spend your birthday!!!
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Glad your finally sorted!!
Happy Birthday mate :) :)
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I was assisted at the crucial moments by some fabricators who were passing :lol:
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Another 6 hour session today has got it in. now just some tightning up to do and trim to be replaced and job done.
I have discovered the following:
It's a lot harder doing a clutch on a 300 as compared to a 200.
You must shore up the engine as 300s tilt the other way to 200s making it very difficult to line up.
Changing a clutch is not a one man job.
What a grand way to spend your birthday!!!
how many hours in total? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: you sure you didnt string the job out for effect?
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Another 6 hour session today has got it in. now just some tightning up to do and trim to be replaced and job done.
I have discovered the following:
It's a lot harder doing a clutch on a 300 as compared to a 200.
You must shore up the engine as 300s tilt the other way to 200s making it very difficult to line up.
Changing a clutch is not a one man job.
What a grand way to spend your birthday!!!
how many hours in total? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: you sure you didnt string the job out for effect?
You rumbled me you clever young fellow!
It only took 20 mins and we spent the rest of the time fabricating earings out of CDS and eating birthday cake but that doesn't make for an exciting thread does it?
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Nice one Guy glad you sorted it, nice to have a go and do it.
HAPPY BIRTHDAY mate.
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took me 12 hours doing it the engine out way :lol:
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jeese
6 hours & job done
can do it in 4 if required
:lol: :lol:
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you win :wink:
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i've had no problems with paricular garage & they done my clutch
look in recommended garages if you want the name of the place.
Dazza
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Given the price of a replacement clutch fork, why the hell would anyone want to weld it if it had broke? I can understand strengthening one, but to just weld a small plate across it as a repair..........................?
Stef