Mud-club
Chat & Social => The Bar - General Chat => Topic started by: bobtailed disco on January 02, 2009, 11:01:24
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Went into work this morning we all got pulled into the office 1by 1 and got asked if any1 wants volantary redundancy... everyone said no. Then i got pulled back in office and got told last 1 in 1st 1 out.
So it was a case of.......
Happy new year we are making you redundant :'(
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are well mate, now you can join the rest of us out of work :)
Jav
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As far as I know "last in first out" is no longer legal
Redundancy should be worked out on a points basis as it's the post that's redundant not the person (if you see what I mean)
Therefore they should look at a number of things and, I believe consult with the workforce, before making a redundancy
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Its happening all over, Christmas Eve my brother was told not to bother coming back in the New Year as there was no more work for him, he has now found out though the guy is using cheaper agency workers to do the same same work, he works in the construction/ building maintenance industry, so is looking for a job with the other million or so now.
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what big watty said is right they ned to speak to all staff and then work out who to get rid of usually takes a couple of months to work out ..
wha they have done is wrong so don't take it lying down [-X
good luck ..
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Ive dealt with this a fair bit over the years, if the company has it stated in the contract or a Union agreement the last in first out policy is perfectly legal.
It was one way of getting out of paying huge redundancy awards, for example I was last in our office but I have worked for the company for 22 years, the next longest serving is 17 years in our office, he would got before me, but then the rest of the office would go before him.
Sorry to hear your bad news.
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Sorry to hear that mate. I am also in the same boat, was made redundant just before Christmas. It seems to be happening everywhere!
The only certainty in life is Death and Taxies………..….or was that Taxes? Can never remember which one!lol! :doh:
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Really sorry to all who are affected by this but the whole thing is something of a legal mine field...
Picking up on various comments on here...
...it's the post that's redundant not the person (if you see what I mean)
This is correct and this is why they will often create a pool of people doing the same job (ie all the sales team, all the admin team etc) with a clear statement that there would need to be, say, 1 redundancy from 5 people identified as being 'at risk'. If you have a unique role within the business and this is then given to someone else, then you might be able to argue that the process was incorrect, but it has always been a case that Tribunals will rarely act against companies downsizing for financial reasons... you would need to find a stronger case...
...they ned to speak to all staff and then work out who to get rid of usually takes a couple of months to work out ..
wha they have done is wrong so don't take it lying down [-X
good luck ..
The numbers involved in the consultation process are governed by the number of anticipated redundancies - I think that the key number is over 20, at which point you need extended (3 month) consultation and discussion with the Unions (if appropriate).
For smaller businesses, the time limit can be as short as 2 weeks - typically you could be advised that your role is at risk and you would be invited to take part in a consultation process to identify whether there are alternative options to redundancy. If you have any clear ideas on how the costs within the business could be reduced, now is the time to raise them as you just might be able to defer the decision...
At the end of any consultation process (for best practice you should have had 2 meetings with Directors of the business... keep notes), a decision would be taken on any redundancy.
Note... you have the right during any consultation process to take paid time off to seek alternative work, attend interviews etc. Make the most of it...
The process has to be seen to be 'fair' - hence the consultation process and most companies will have a section within the Employee Handbook (you may have been given a copy when you started, or it may be on any staff notice board). If it's on the board, you have a right to ask for a copy - at worst, it gives you information should you need to go to Tribunal, at worst, it may put the willies up them and increase any financial incentive or offer to leave...
Most of these clauses will identify standard processes in the event of redundancy - normally recruitment freeze, call for voluntary redundancies and then followed by a 'last in, first out' process.
Whilst every case is different, it would appear that they have followed the process in a manner that adheres to any such policy and would therefore be deemed as 'fair' at a Tribunal.... really sorry to lay it out like this... :(
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Big Watty is right they can't do it like that anymore but if it's any help the Vauxhall dealer i worked for 18 years ago did this and my daughter had just been born.To be honest they did me a favour, take it as a new year/new start and do what YOU want to do,good luck mate.
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When I was at Bonar I'd been there the longest of the 3 of us and they got rid of me, one of the other 2 had been doing the job less than six months but for 6 grand less than Mark or I and Mark had been on the expensive CAD course (if they'd sent me I think they knew I'd have left straight away).
I think my supervisor was told to get rid of me and make the "point" fit the person, he let me know I had grounds to appeal but TBH I didn't want to stay.
I took some satisfaction that the MD was fired whilst I was working my notice, the company folded about a year later after Mark had walked out too.
I genuinely hope that you find something son lads but just think on, if you take it as a stopgap then it's a stopgap (nothing wrong with that), don't take a crumby job and still be there in 5 year's time.
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Its happening all over, Christmas Eve my brother was told not to bother coming back in the New Year as there was no more work for him, he has now found out though the guy is using cheaper agency workers to do the same same work, he works in the construction/ building maintenance industry, so is looking for a job with the other million or so now.
was your brother employed by the company as i understand that it is illegal to dismiss staff then replace them with cheaper. if he was self employed then this doesn't apply though.
tell him i wish him luck with job hunting.
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Not a good way to start the year :(
The consultation process only applies when there's more than a certain number at risk of redundancy. If it's just one or two people then they can do it the way they've done it.
I was made redundant a couple of years ago because they were doing away with my position all over the country. I walked in to the office at 9 and was home by 10 :'( Got a reasonable cash sum (five years service) and kept myself busy with agency work until I got another 'proper' job.
Once again I'm potentially 'at risk'...
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Its happening all over, Christmas Eve my brother was told not to bother coming back in the New Year as there was no more work for him, he has now found out though the guy is using cheaper agency workers to do the same same work, he works in the construction/ building maintenance industry, so is looking for a job with the other million or so now.
was your brother employed by the company as i understand that it is illegal to dismiss staff then replace them with cheaper. if he was self employed then this doesn't apply though.
tell him i wish him luck with job hunting.
Will be seeing him this week, not sure if he was self employed or not, I know he had an appointment with his union rep this week, thanks for the concern :)
Cheers
Keith