Up Rating Brakes

[drum]

Anybody know what the best options for uprating the brakes on a 54 plate, 110 defender are?

It already has discs all round, but as I've got 35" Tyres sometimes I feel I could do with just that little bit more stopping power. And the pads have just about had it (20,000 miles), I either do the whole lot, or just the pads.

[Henry Webster]

Hi Drum,

I use EBC Green Stuff pads on the rally car which work very well.  These are the first step of upgrade from standard and work very well from cold and even better when hot.

I think I am going to go to their full rally spec pads next year though!  

In what way are you not satisfied with the current set up - do you get fade or is it just struggling to stop?

I have also got grooved/cross drilled discs on the rally car, these are good at taking the glaze off the pads and dealing with the heat, but are noisier and potentially wear the pads faster.  I wouldn't think that they would be necessary on a road car, but there's not much wrong with the standard set up really when its in good order.

H

[drum]

Sometimes I need to put abit more forse into the pedal, than I think I need to, maybe I'm just a weed, but I think it's down to the extra momentum of the bigger wheels. (Atleast that's my excuse and I'm sticking to it)

Are the green Pads a straight swap, so that all I need to do is replace all the pads? Sounds an ideal first step, as the padds will need doing in the next few k anyways.

[Henry Webster]

Yes EBC do the Green Stuff pads to fit your vehicle - I have a 110 front axle and a 90 rear on the racer anyway...

If you've got to fit pads anyway it might well be something worth trying.

H

[drum]

Yet another thing to add to the shopping list  :(

Any idea on suppliers for them, I've seen them advertised but I can't remember where?

[Henry Webster]

Do a web search for them there are a couple of good online sales places.

Failing that your usual pattern parts supplier might well be able to deal, I believe that Beamach distribute them.

H

[Henry Webster]

http://www.ebcbrakesdirect.com/
http://www.brakes4u.co.uk/

[drum]

Thanks Henry, I'll keep an eye out as I know my current ones are on the way out, hopefully I'll find them before they go.

[muddyweb]

Ther larger tyre diameter will have an effect on braking efficiency.  Do you have vented discs on the front ?

Just a thought about expensive pads... if you do a lot of plugging through nasty stuff, brake pads do have a tendency to wear quicker.  So bear that in mind when making the decision on how much you want to spend  :shock:

[drum]

Ther larger tyre diameter will have an effect on braking efficiency.  Do you have vented discs on the front ?

I believe I do but it's dark and damp out side so I can't be certain. (I'm 99% certain they are)

Just a thought about expensive pads... if you do a lot of plugging through nasty stuff, brake pads do have a tendency to wear quicker.  So bear that in mind when making the decision on how much you want to spend  :shock:

Hmm, good point. The stock ones have lasted 20k plus with swimming lessons being given from day 2 of ownership. If I'm to believe the blurb, the Green ones are harder wearing, with more stopping power. I can live with, the cost of the pads once a year, aslong as it doesn't get much more frequent.

[Henry Webster]

I don't think that EBC should be all that more expensive than standard genuine pads.

H

[littlepow]

If your rims are bigger then get your disks upgraded to a larger size. If it's just the tyres, then try grooved disks as this will remove any glazing from the pads. Always helps having pads with a clean face. If you get uprated pads, then be carefull not to get ones that require a higher temprature to work effectively. Or you can always uprate your calipers.

[James.Harwood]

Go for the EBC green pads as sugested and look at groved disks, or possibly grooved and cross drilled, if you have won the lottery, probably avalable as EBC as well, could be worth talking to demon tweeks at wrexham see what they have to offer.  got this set up on SWMBO's Fiesta Sport, stopes with your innards against the windscreen.

http://www.demon-tweeks.co.uk/

[dave_2A_2.25Turbo]

. get your disks upgraded to a larger size

Trouble is - that means calipers as well, and it starts to get expensive.  You're better off trying uprated pads first, then grooved discs.

Or start braking earlier.....

[drum]

Does anybody know if the EBC SUV\4x4 Uprated are the Same as the GreenStuff pads?? Some seem to refer to them as one, and some refer to them as the other??

[Henry Webster]

Does anybody know if the EBC SUV\4x4 Uprated are the Same as the GreenStuff pads?? Some seem to refer to them as one, and some refer to them as the other??

Yup they are the same thing.  Basically they use the GreenStuff friction material but market them as SUV/4x4 Uprated.

Hope they work well for you.

H

[V8MoneyPit]

There are some simple rules to apply here. I go through this almost daily with Mini owners!

If you can stamp on the brakes and lock up the wheels, this is the most braking 'power' you can achieve. If you are just trying to reduce the pedal effort required to achieve the same force at the wheels you need to change the hydraulic ratio. This is achieved by using a larger ratio servo or smaller diameter master cylinder or larger diameter caliper pistons. Or a combination. Alternatively, larger diameter discs and appropriate calipers. This means the pads are acting at a larger radius and so need less effort to retard the rotation than a smaller disc.

If you are finding the brakes are fading you need to dissipate the heat. This is achieved with vented discs or similar.

The various pad materials available are designed to work most efficiently and various temperatures. If you were flat out round a race track for 20 laps, the brakes would be operating at a higher temperature than out for a Sunday drive. The pad material for each situation would need to be different to work at it's best.

[drum]

Does anybody know if the EBC SUV\4x4 Uprated are the Same as the GreenStuff pads?? Some seem to refer to them as one, and some refer to them as the other??

Yup they are the same thing.  Basically they use the GreenStuff friction material but market them as SUV/4x4 Uprated.

Hope they work well for you.

H

Thanks Henry.

[drum]

Steve,

I have ABS so it's not quite so simple as locking the brakes up. The only ttimes I've every triggered the ABS are either on ice, or muddy\wet grass etc. I've never triggered it on a road situation.

I feel that sometimes the breaking could be better, I don't think that if I stamped on the breaks at 30 I would trgger the ABS, or skid. so ideally I think more friction is the answer.

Given that I need new pads anyways, I'll start by upgrading them, to the recommended. They're not that much more than LR ones anyway, and I wouldn't use Pattern Parts on brakes anyway. If that doesn't improve things, I'll try discs and calipers.

[Jim-Willy]

I'll be interested in what you think of them Drum cos my brakes are pants.

[V8MoneyPit]

Working with old Mini's and Morris Minor's on a daily basis, *anything* else has excellent brakes!!

[Xtremeteam]

I'll be interested in what you think of them Drum cos my brakes are pants.

tyo cure that fit a disc rear axle


on the racer have disc fronts & a drum salsbury on the back,brakes are ok but nothing special,

on my road 90 have discs all round & can out brake most hot hatches  

[Jim-Willy]

I'll be interested in what you think of them Drum cos my brakes are pants.

tyo cure that fit a disc rear axle


on the racer have disc fronts & a drum salsbury on the back,brakes are ok but nothing special,

on my road 90 have discs all round & can out brake most hot hatches  

My 90 has disks all the way around but the brakes are a joke, cant lock it up at 20mph, nowt wrong with the vac pump, the pads are new, the cylinders aint seized?

[Xtremeteam]

what pads are you using??

i have ferodo all round,would also consider braided hoses as they make a huge difference to the feel of the peddle

[Jim-Willy]

what pads are you using??

i have ferodo all round,would also consider braided hoses as they make a huge difference to the feel of the peddle

OEM i think, cant remember.  Its wierd no matter how hard ya press it doesnt brake any harder.

[Henry Webster]

on the racer have disc fronts & a drum salsbury on the back,brakes are ok but nothing special,

on my road 90 have discs all round & can out brake most hot hatches  

That sounds like the wrong way round, Mike - I'd go for the better brakes on the racer any day.  Why don't you do a swap.  Put the salisbury on the road car and the disc braked one on the racer - oh and whilst you're at it drop a Truetrac in it! :lol:  :lol:

 H

[Xtremeteam]

on the racer have disc fronts & a drum salsbury on the back,brakes are ok but nothing special,

on my road 90 have discs all round & can out brake most hot hatches  

That sounds like the wrong way round, Mike - I'd go for the better brakes on the racer any day.  Why don't you do a swap.  Put the salisbury on the road car and the disc braked one on the racer - oh and whilst you're at it drop a Truetrac in it! :lol:  :lol:

 H

if i fitted the disc rear axle to the racer i would need to feed it diffs  
where as with the strength of the salsbury dont carry any spares for the rear axle whatsoever & i can live with ok brakes,
also i drive properly using the gears to slow down not the brakes  
well brakes slow you down dont they  :twisted:

[drum]

[bauble]!!

Just been under the 110 adjusting the handbrake, as it wasn't making any difference. And one of the rear discs is well and truly scoured on one side. Just one out of the 4  :(  So I'll have to change the rear  discs aswell :(  :(

When I was washing it after Waddon I checked them, and the pads were need doing but not still had life left in them. It appears while I've been research the Pads etc, I've killed a disc.

[Xtremeteam]

you can but the discs singularly though    Ã‚£15 + the dreaded

ferodo pads are £18 is +v

[drum]

Don't you have to change them in pairs??

Decided to go for EBC GreenStuff Pads All round.