P38 air suspension

[v8kenny]

Evening Chaps
I have recently bought a Jap import 4.6 HSE which I am generally very happy with
I have some questions re the air suspension though
When the motor has been sat for a while the suspension ends up right down - is this normal or is there maybe a leak in the system ? - has to sit for a few days for this to happen - no problems if used daily
Once the suspension has gone right down then it can take up to 5 minutes for it to pump up to normal ride height (light on eas display stops flashing) - surely it should pump up the system far quicker than this even when sat down
I wonder if the compressor is on its way out - I can steal (borrow) a known fully working comp. from my brother in law's P38 to see if this is any better - any issues with me disconnecting/connecting compressors ?
If it the compressor has anyone tried the repair kits on ebay (piston, barrel and teflon seal )that are supposed to refurb the comp.? - at about £85 a lot less than a new comp.
There are no fault messages showing and once suspension is up to speed  everything works fine  -  any suggestions please

[thermidorthelobster]

Sounds like you have a leak, and your compressor is not A1.

Easiest way to check for leaks is to spray water with fairy liquid in around the join between the plastic and the rubber in each spring, and around the unions at the top.  Look for bubbles.  If you find some, then that's good, because it's better to repair/replace a spring than the valve block.  The o-rings in the unions and in the valve block sometimes fail, and these can be replaced.

If your P38 has ever got mucky, the compressor may have sucked in some crud;  check the filter in the rear quarter post behind the lights.  You might want to pop the compressor out and check it for obvious signs of wear as it's quite easy.  If you can try a different compressor then do so, it should be problem-free.

On mine I just replaced the compressor, so I can't really comment on the fixing kits.

AndyCWB's page at http://www.p38a.co.uk is a great resource for troubleshooting your truck.  I have the RAVE cd which includes detailed diagrams and explanations for all the air suspension bits (and the rest of it) if you need it.

[v8kenny]

Thanks David
So if I try my brother in law's comp. I won't induce any fault codes on his motor ?
Will try a leak test first as this won't be doing the comp. any good working more than it should
When you disconnect the comp. does this purge all the air out of the system
and make it drop quickly to the bump stops ?

[Xtremeteam]

changing the comp "shouldnt" flash any fault codes up,

ull be looking in the rear 1/4 for a while if ur after the compressor filter,the pump is situated on the LHS of the engine bay & the filter is on the front of the pump,remove the filter & housing from the pump & with it running stick ur finger over the end o the inlet,it should have a fair sook to it,if not the comp is on its way out,

Also if ur rangie has ever had a burst exhaust id bet that the pipes have been melted on the rear chassis rail,also they chaff through betwen the chassis & the body & are an absolute brstd to fix,
air bags... check to see if they are perished,if they are spray some soapy water on them to check for leaks,does it go down if parked at a slight angle?

like 2 wheels up the kirb?

if so its a high posibility of the airbags have a leak

[v8kenny]

Cheers Mikee
Found the diagrams for removing comp / air springs on rave
When you pull the outlet pipe off the comp to remove it does the air escape here or is it just like taking an air tool from the hose with no leaks
I'll try your sook test (oo'er missus !) at the weekend
It seems to drop down offside rear first then offside front - nearside stays up fine
When system is back to normal it rides even with no lean
Everything seems to be pointing at a leaky airbag - ok to do just one or do they need done in pairs ?
If I have to replace them all AND the comp I might as well bin the lot and fit coil spring kit !

[thermidorthelobster]

Make sure you drain the air out of the system before you disconnect anything.  Undo the drain plug at the back of the reservoir under the sill below the driver's seat.  As it loosens it will let air through and the system will depressurise.  It won't fly off at high speed as the pressure is released before it gets to the end of the thread.

[Xtremeteam]

Cheers Mikee
Found the diagrams for removing comp / air springs on rave
When you pull the outlet pipe off the comp to remove it does the air escape here or is it just like taking an air tool from the hose with no leaks
I'll try your sook test (oo'er missus !) at the weekend
It seems to drop down offside rear first then offside front - nearside stays up fine
When system is back to normal it rides even with no lean
Everything seems to be pointing at a leaky airbag - ok to do just one or do they need done in pairs ?
If I have to replace them all AND the comp I might as well bin the lot and fit coil spring kit !

Its okay to just do the one,although if ones started then u might need to replace the rest,personally dont bother with taking the bung out the tank,its far to much fafing about & have u ever tried to get it out?
just use a 10 mm spanner & whip the outlet connection of the compressor,ull get a squirt of air nowt much motor prob wont even go down as ur not disturbing the valve block.

when uve swapped the comp over start it up n leave it ticking over for 10 min with the drivers door open,this will charge the system,close the door & it should rise up

[Xtremeteam]

If I have to replace them all AND the comp I might as well bin the lot and fit coil spring kit !

at approx £80-100 for a bag & £100+ for a comp id personally stay with the air,

if the bags are perished & the pump is a bit tired its a crap ssetup,get it all working good & its a brilliant set up

[thermidorthelobster]

You can buy OEM air bags as well, in fact they're from the same supplier but a lot cheaper than the Land Rover genuine part.

If it turns out to be the valve block, then for the sake of a grand or so, you'd probably be better off financially with the coils...  but I always think it's a shame to lose the air suspension as it's part of the charm of the vehicle.

[Grant]

valve block rebuild kit- about £15  

www.rover-renovations.com cant recommend that guy enough- just remember customs/VAT. you might get hit with it, you might not

I rebuilt my compressor with the kit by the way, very easy. Stupidly, i just swapped the compressor over for a new one thinking it would solve my constant running problem but it didnt (i've got a leak somewhere) so i've got one sitting around (minus mounts)

loads of instructions here www.rangerovers.net

Dont convert to coils, good luck

[v8kenny]

i just swapped the compressor over for a new one thinking it would solve my constant running problem but it didnt (i've got a leak somewhere) so i've got one sitting around (minus mounts)

Does that mean you may have one for sale then if needed  
Thanks for all your input guys, will keep me busy this weekend if it ever stops raining here :roll:
Will let you know how I get on

[v8kenny]

BTW - something spooky going on here
When this thread started thermidor was lying under a Landy in his avatar and now he's half way up a mountain and Mikee was called sootysport and now he is back to good old Redlinemike - what's going on ?  :lol:

[thermidorthelobster]

When this thread started thermidor was lying under a Landy in his avatar and now he's half way up a mountain

My avatar changes each time you load it, which causes some confusion in threads where it's crucial to the plot :)

[v8kenny]

When this thread started thermidor was lying under a Landy in his avatar and now he's half way up a mountain

My avatar changes each time you load it, which causes some confusion in threads where it's crucial to the plot :)

So how many times would I have to view your page before they start repeating ? :lol:

[thermidorthelobster]

I think there's about 18 of them in there at the moment, but they come at random, so two might come along at once, or you might get a surprise!

[Range Rover Blues]

Anyway, I've been to Rover Renovations too, top bloke.  Have a look at the Arnott GIII air springs (I keep saying this but) I have a pair for the rear of your car that were sent by mistake, if you want to avoid shipping and duty they are in my loft (but not cheap).

If one bag leaks then chances are when the car is self leveling (every 4 hours IIRC when parked) then eventually it will end up on the bump stops.  On the RRC you can disable the sytem with a switch under the driver's seat that tells the ecu there is a door open, it's for changing wheels etc.  Leave this switched on for a couple of days and see which corner goes down then.

A leaky bag could be muck in the valve O rings, a leaky union or damaged pipe but also take a look at the quality of your bags, one of mine was threadbare :shock:  I'm surprised it stayed up.

If you know someone with Rovacom you can a**e around with the ride height settings to your heart's content.  I have GIII bags on the LSE and my high profile is about 2 higher at the front and 3" at the back, I run plus 1" shocks on the fornt and plus 2" on the back without the bags threatening to explode.

Have a look in my galery.

P.S. it does sound like the pump is past it's best.  When you turn the engine off it will lower to the level of the lowest corner, so don't worry if it goes down when you park on a curb etc.

[v8kenny]

 On the RRC you can disable the sytem with a switch under the driver's seat that tells the ecu there is a door open, it's for changing wheels etc.  Leave this switched on for a couple of days and see which corner goes down then.

AFAIK the way to stop the suspension going down on a P38 when changing wheels is to open the top tailgate and switch the hazards on - not really an option for a couple of days continuously    
 I will certainly have a look under the seat but I bet P38's are different from classics :roll:
Pity really - an ideal way to find which corner is causing the problem

[waveydavey]

For waht it's worht I have the workshop manuals as PDF's. THey don't help with overhauling the parts as the LR system is to change the whole unit and charge a fortune but if any use I can Email them; you will need broadband though as they are not small files.

[v8kenny]

For waht it's worht I have the workshop manuals as PDF's. THey don't help with overhauling the parts as the LR system is to change the whole unit and charge a fortune but if any use I can Email them; you will need broadband though as they are not small files.

Thanks Wavey - I already have them on disc but the offer is much appreciated
Think it might be a good idea to buy a proper manual - looks like I may need it ! :lol:

[Range Rover Blues]

AFAIK the way to stop the suspension going down on a P38 when changing wheels is to open the top tailgate and switch the hazards on - not really an option for a couple of days continuously    
 I will certainly have a look under the seat but I bet P38's are different from classics :roll:
Pity really - an ideal way to find which corner is causing the problem

Ah, that would explain what the guy at the tyre place was doing then :lol:

[v8kenny]

Ah, that would explain what the guy at the tyre place was doing then :lol:

 :lol:  :lol:  :lol:

[thermidorthelobster]

AFAIK the way to stop the suspension going down on a P38 when changing wheels is to open the top tailgate and switch the hazards on - not really an option for a couple of days continuously    

Still not much help for 2 days, but IIRC either opening the bottom tailgate, or the driver's door, inhibits the EAS.  You'd still want to put the body on axle stands if you were working on it, though.

[v8kenny]

Had a look under the rangie today when I got back from work
All the air bags look in really good nick - tried spraying them with some soapy water and no sign of leaks - couldn't hear any air escaping from anywhere either, including round about the reservoir and pipes I could trace - must admit it was getting darkish by this time so maybe a plan if I can get it onto my mate's ramp during the week or when I have time
Took the filter off the end of the compressor and put my finger over the hole - some suction present but unsure how strong it should be
After the suspension got itself up to height the compressor was quite hot to touch - is this normal ? - it also cut in for about 20 sec every minute or so but did not run continuously, which I hope is a good sign
I know I have air escaping from somewhere as it does go to the bumpstops after about 3 days and needs about 2 min for suspension to come up to height after about 1 day - under a day then it is almost instant - have noticed it doesn't go down as quick now I am parking on the flat
Anyone  got any further thoughts ?
Thanks
Kenny

[Range Rover Blues]

Parking on flat groudn will make a difference.  It could also be that the O rings in the valves weep a bit, some of them are non-return valves for the pressurised system.

Anyway, it sounds like it's holding pressure for a day in the tank, which is good.  Possibly your pump is past it's best.