AuthorTopic: more4 climate change program  (Read 1136 times)

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Offline blackbob

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more4 climate change program
« on: March 13, 2007, 18:32:49 »
did any one see more4s climate change program
the great global warming swindle
very interesting co aint the cause of global warming
they have proved that high co is a biproduct of global warming mainly from the seas and plants as the world gets heated by the sun the seas produce co gasses as a result of warming and its also happens slowly ie the sea warms then releases the gas this takes approx 200 years to show after the warming takes place
this was proved from ice core samples and geoligy studies
and the earth has always been in a warming cooling cycle
so they basicly said its a goverment con to raise funds
and the study of global warming has created about 100000 jobs world wide
love's mud and lpg and the wife
skype ekken3011

Offline Lord Shagg-Pyle

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more4 climate change program
« Reply #1 on: March 13, 2007, 18:55:09 »
Somehow I don't think the current government will take much notice, especially as they have now introduced more ways of taxing the people.

Offline landy4x4xfar

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taxs
« Reply #2 on: March 13, 2007, 19:25:01 »
ok we know it's a con
they tax us for this and that
BUT
where do our taxes go, wot do we pay  Ã‚£10 & £40 for to fly  

i bet it's in there pockets
pays for trips to other countrys to see wot they are wasteing money on
so they can screw it out of us when they get back

we need to know where it is going and how will this help (not)

if we all said "sod it just for one day" Do nothing the place would go under
 NO cars, planes,work,shopping,school,we would take them out in one go
   just dont STAY AT HOME that day and make it a friday so we all get a long weekend who with me

Offline Manicminer

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more4 climate change program
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2007, 19:26:11 »
I have copied this from another forum >>>

There was a thread on another forum about one of my favorite subjects - global warming. A new UN report came out today blaming us all for global warming. Yeah, that's right, those paragons of wisdom at the United Nations. Could not possibly any politics involved there! Anyway, my wife tells me I like to pontificate, and I could not help but do so on the subject. After putting my two little fingers to so much work typing it I figured I'd post a copy here.

I've spent nearly my whole life prospecting in glacial terrain here in southern Alaska. I get to see the signs of retreating glaciers every day. The fact is the glaciers have been coming and going for ages.

Every time I hear somebody go on about global warming, I have to wonder that I must have taken different classes in school. My old geology teacher taught us about global warming, explaining how the last glacial advance had long since peaked, and that the earth has warmed ever since. And the glaciers have been receding ever since. The other thing I was taught was that this is not a smooth trend, but something that happens in fits and starts. The Vikings inhabited Greenland during a remarkable warm spell at that time that made Greenland a more pleasant place to live. Later came the "Little Ice Age" when people could walk across the Thames River in London. In general the glaciers have receded and the earth has warmed, but there are ups and downs along the way.

I learned all this in school, and now 40 years later people are getting up and announcing global warming like they just discovered it. Old news, I'm afraid. The only new deal is trying to blame it all on us.

Well, let's see, here is a little map from http://jove.geol.niu.edu/faculty/fischer/4...IF/Glaciers.htm Go there for a great synopsis about mid-way down the page.



The map shows the maximum extent of the last three glacial advances. The have been many more, but the most recent advances destroy evidence of older advances. Basically the earth cools, the ice gets to a certain point, then the earth warms, and the ice recedes. Now, the ice hit its last maximum tens of thousands of years ago. If we are the cause of global warming, are they saying that tens of thousands of years ago our campfires started the ice receding? What about the recessions hundreds of thousands of years ago? Did we cause those also?

Global warming is a fact, folks. Anybody who tries to argue there is not is going to lose. Global warming is a fact recorded in geologic evidence. It is a classic way to win an argument. Start with a known fact and draw people into debating it. That is why the political powers that be started the debate over global warming. They are hiding the real debate and once they win the one about global warming, the argument they are really trying to make happens when you are not even looking. Classic smoke and mirrors.

The only debate is about whether we might be somehow adding to the rate at which the earth is warming. But the earth is warming nonetheless, and there is nothing anyone will be able to do to stop it. Never forget that part. The only thing that will stop global warming is the start of the next glacial advance. There are lots of theories about why the ice eventually comes back but looking at past history makes a betting man bet that it will come back someday.

But are we doing things that might be adding to the warming cycle? I do not suppose it is impossible. They talk about how recent years are setting temperature records. Well, yeah, if the earth is warming over time, it only stands to reason that temperature records in the long run will tend to be on the high end. So more recent years will have higher highs than years past. And as we have seen, you can have temporary spurts both up and down in temperatures. So just because we are having a warm spurt now does not impress me. What about fossil fuel emissions? We are all being told these "greenhouse gases" will lead to inevitable rises in temperature. But by analyzing gas bubbles trapped in ice core samples, it has been found that the levels of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, previously thought to be constant, actually varied significantly during the last 11,000 years prior to the industrial age. During some earlier periods, the temperature increased before the carbon dioxide levels began to rise, sometimes with as much as a 400-to-1000-year lag. The correlation is a weak one at best with complex interactions that nobody yet can claim to understand fully.

What about those pesky volcanoes? Volcanoes release more than 130 million tons of CO2 into the atmosphere every year. Shouldn't we do something about that?

What about all the scientists? Well, scientists are herd animals. Once they get going, they all tend to run in the same direction. And there is lots of funding to be had proving global warming. It is easy research and easy money, looking to prove that the earth is warming and the ice receding. Just like they taught me in school!

There is a of course a political agenda behind all this. There are people that want you and I to act in certain ways. We should be energy efficient and save fuel and not waste. Frankly, I can't argue with any of that. We can and probably should act to be less wasteful as a nation.

So maybe it all really does not matter per se, if it gets us to be better citizens of the planet. But I still can't help but to get worked up somewhat when I see Al Gore "proving" global warming and telling me I need to be frugal. From the guy who thinks he invented the internet and who has driven in more big cars and put more miles on in jets than 99.99% of the people on the planet. The inconvenient truth is that there is a word for those that do not practice what they preach. Maybe he figures that if he get all the rest of us to have less impact on the planet it will make up for the huge dent he has personally put in it. "Do as I say, not as I do"!

Oh well, opinions are like noses, most everybody has one. And I'm not saying mine is any more important than anybody else's. I'm just a dumb schmuck in Alaska. The real irony is that just when we clean up our act and act like responsible citizens of the planet a huge freaking asteroid will probably plow into the earth in one of those little incidents designed to remind us just how little importance we may have in the universe as a whole. Stuff happens!


And this>>>>>

Climate chaos? Don't believe it

By Christopher Monckton, Sunday Telegraph
Last Updated: 12:14am GMT 05/11/2006

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/11/05/nosplit/nwarm05.xml

The Stern report last week predicted dire economic and social effects of unchecked global warming. In what many will see as a highly controversial polemic, Christopher Monckton disputes the 'facts' of this impending apocalypse and accuses the UN and its scientists of distorting the truth


Biblical droughts, floods, plagues and extinctions?


Last week, Gordon Brown and his chief economist both said global warming was the worst "market failure" ever. That loaded soundbite suggests that the "climate-change" scare is less about saving the planet than, in Jacques Chirac's chilling phrase, "creating world government". This week and next, I'll reveal how politicians, scientists and bureaucrats contrived a threat of Biblical floods, droughts, plagues, and extinctions worthier of St John the Divine than of science.

Sir Nicholas Stern's report on the economics of climate change, which was published last week, says that the debate is over. It isn't. There are more greenhouse gases in the air than there were, so the world should warm a bit, but that's as far as the "consensus" goes. After the recent hysteria, you may not find the truth easy to believe. So you can find all my references and detailed calculations here.

The Royal Society says there's a worldwide scientific consensus. It brands Apocalypse-deniers as paid lackeys of coal and oil corporations. I declare my interest: I once took the taxpayer's shilling and advised Margaret Thatcher, FRS, on scientific scams and scares. Alas, not a red cent from Exxon.

In 1988, James Hansen, a climatologist, told the US Congress that temperature would rise 0.3C by the end of the century (it rose 0.1C), and that sea level would rise several feet (no, one inch). The UN set up a transnational bureaucracy, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC). The UK taxpayer unwittingly meets the entire cost of its scientific team, which, in 2001, produced the Third Assessment Report, a Bible-length document presenting apocalyptic conclusions well beyond previous reports.

This week, I'll show how the UN undervalued the sun's effects on historical and contemporary climate, slashed the natural greenhouse effect, overstated the past century's temperature increase, repealed a fundamental law of physics and tripled the man-made greenhouse effect.

Next week, I'll demonstrate the atrocious economic, political and environmental cost of the high-tax, zero-freedom, bureaucratic centralism implicit in Stern's report; I'll compare the global-warming scare with previous sci-fi alarums; and I'll show how the environmentalists' "precautionary principle" (get the state to interfere now, just in case) is killing people.

So to the scare. First, the UN implies that carbon dioxide ended the last four ice ages. It displays two 450,000-year graphs: a sawtooth curve of temperature and a sawtooth of airborne CO2 that's scaled to look similar. Usually, similar curves are superimposed for comparison. The UN didn't do that. If it had, the truth would have shown: the changes in temperature preceded the changes in CO2 levels.

Next, the UN abolished the medieval warm period (the global warming at the end of the First Millennium AD). In 1995, David Deming, a geoscientist at the University of Oklahoma, had written an article reconstructing 150 years of North American temperatures from borehole data. He later wrote: "With the publication of the article in Science, I gained significant credibility in the community of scientists working on climate change. They thought I was one of them, someone who would pervert science in the service of social and political causes. One of them let his guard down. A major person working in the area of climate change and global warming sent me an astonishing email that said: 'We have to get rid of the Medieval Warm Period.' "

So they did. The UN's second assessment report, in 1996, showed a 1,000-year graph demonstrating that temperature in the Middle Ages was warmer than today. But the 2001 report contained a new graph showing no medieval warm period. It wrongly concluded that the 20th century was the warmest for 1,000 years. The graph looked like an ice hockey-stick. The wrongly flat AD1000-AD1900 temperature line was the shaft: the uptick from 1900 to 2000 was the blade. Here's how they did it:

• They gave one technique for reconstructing pre-thermometer temperature 390 times more weight than any other (but didn't say so).

• The technique they overweighted was one which the UN's 1996 report had said was unsafe: measurement of tree-rings from bristlecone pines. Tree-rings are wider in warmer years, but pine-rings are also wider when there's more carbon dioxide in the air: it's plant food. This carbon dioxide fertilisation distorts the calculations.

• They said they had included 24 data sets going back to 1400. Without saying so, they left out the set showing the medieval warm period, tucking it into a folder marked "Censored Data".

• They used a computer model to draw the graph from the data, but scientists later found that the model almost always drew hockey-sticks even if they fed in random, electronic "red noise".


The large, full-colour "hockey-stick" was the key graph in the UN's 2001 report, and the only one to appear six times. The Canadian Government copied it to every household. Four years passed before a leading scientific journal would publish the truth about the graph. Did the UN or the Canadian government apologise? Of course not. The UN still uses the graph in its publications.

Even after the "hockey stick" graph was exposed, scientific papers apparently confirming its abolition of the medieval warm period appeared. The US Senate asked independent statisticians to investigate. They found that the graph was meretricious, and that known associates of the scientists who had compiled it had written many of the papers supporting its conclusion.

The UN, echoed by Stern, says the graph isn't important. It is. Scores of scientific papers show that the medieval warm period was real, global and up to 3C warmer than now. Then, there were no glaciers in the tropical Andes: today they're there. There were Viking farms in Greenland: now they're under permafrost. There was little ice at the North Pole: a Chinese naval squadron sailed right round the Arctic in 1421 and found none.

The Antarctic, which holds 90 per cent of the world's ice and nearly all its 160,000 glaciers, has cooled and gained ice-mass in the past 30 years, reversing a 6,000-year melting trend. Data from 6,000 boreholes worldwide show global temperatures were higher in the Middle Ages than now. And the snows of Kilimanjaro are vanishing not because summit temperature is rising (it isn't) but because post-colonial deforestation has dried the air. Al Gore please note.

In some places it was also warmer than now in the Bronze Age and in Roman times. It wasn't CO2 that caused those warm periods. It was the sun. So the UN adjusted the maths and all but extinguished the sun's role in today's warming. Here's how:

• The UN dated its list of "forcings" (influences on temperature) from 1750, when the sun, and consequently air temperature, was almost as warm as now. But its start-date for the increase in world temperature was 1900, when the sun, and temperature, were much cooler.

• Every "forcing" produces "climate feedbacks" making temperature rise faster. For instance, as temperature rises in response to a forcing, the air carries more water vapour, the most important greenhouse gas; and polar ice melts, increasing heat absorption. Up goes the temperature again. The UN more than doubled the base forcings from greenhouse gases to allow for climate feedbacks. It didn't do the same for the base solar forcing.

Two centuries ago, the astronomer William Herschel was reading Adam Smith's Wealth of Nations when he noticed that quoted grain prices fell when the number of sunspots rose. Gales of laughter ensued, but he was right. At solar maxima, when the sun was at its hottest and sunspots showed, temperature was warmer, grain grew faster and prices fell. Such observations show that even small solar changes affect climate detectably. But recent solar changes have been big.

Sami Solanki, a solar physicist, says that in the past half-century the sun has been warmer, for longer, than at any time in at least the past 11,400 years, contributing a base forcing equivalent to a quarter of the past century's warming. That's before adding climate feedbacks.

The UN expresses its heat-energy forcings in watts per square metre per second. It estimates that the sun caused just 0.3 watts of forcing since 1750. Begin in 1900 to match the temperature start-date, and the base solar forcing more than doubles to 0.7 watts. Multiply by 2.7, which the Royal Society suggests is the UN's current factor for climate feedbacks, and you get 1.9 watts – more than six times the UN's figure.

The entire 20th-century warming from all sources was below 2 watts. The sun could have caused just about all of it.

Next, the UN slashed the natural greenhouse effect by 40 per cent from 33C in the climate-physics textbooks to 20C, making the man-made additions appear bigger.

Then the UN chose the biggest 20th-century temperature increase it could find. Stern says: "As anticipated by scientists, global mean surface temperatures have risen over the past century." As anticipated? Only 30 years ago, scientists were anticipating a new Ice Age and writing books called The Cooling.

In the US, where weather records have been more reliable than elsewhere, 20th-century temperature went up by only 0.3C. AccuWeather, a worldwide meteorological service, reckons world temperature rose by 0.45C. The US National Climate Data Centre says 0.5C. Any advance on 0.5? The UN went for 0.6C, probably distorted by urban growth near many of the world's fast-disappearing temperature stations.

The number of temperature stations round the world peaked at 6,000 in 1970. It's fallen by two-thirds to 2,000 now: a real "hockey-stick" curve, and an instance of the UN's growing reliance on computer guesswork rather than facts.

Even a 0.6C temperature rise wasn't enough. So the UN repealed a fundamental physical law. Buried in a sub-chapter in its 2001 report is a short but revealing section discussing "lambda": the crucial factor converting forcings to temperature. The UN said its climate models had found lambda near-invariant at 0.5C per watt of forcing.

You don't need computer models to "find" lambda. Its value is given by a century-old law, derived experimentally by a Slovenian professor and proved by his Austrian student (who later committed suicide when his scientific compatriots refused to believe in atoms). The Stefan-Boltzmann law, not mentioned once in the UN's 2001 report, is as central to the thermodynamics of climate as Einstein's later equation is to astrophysics. Like Einstein's, it relates energy to the square of the speed of light, but by reference to temperature rather than mass.

The bigger the value of lambda, the bigger the temperature increase the UN could predict. Using poor Ludwig Boltzmann's law, lambda's true value is just 0.22-0.3C per watt. In 2001, the UN effectively repealed the law, doubling lambda to 0.5C per watt. A recent paper by James Hansen says lambda should be 0.67, 0.75 or 1C: take your pick. Sir John Houghton, who chaired the UN's scientific assessment working group until recently, tells me it now puts lambda at 0.8C: that's 3C for a 3.7-watt doubling of airborne CO2. Most of the UN's computer models have used 1C. Stern implies 1.9C.

On the UN's figures, the entire greenhouse-gas forcing in the 20th century was 2 watts. Multiplying by the correct value of lambda gives a temperature increase of 0.44 to 0.6C, in line with observation. But using Stern's 1.9C per watt gives 3.8C. Where did 85 per cent of his imagined 20th-century warming go? As Professor Dick Lindzen of MIT pointed out in The Sunday Telegraph last week, the UK's Hadley Centre had the same problem, and solved it by dividing its modelled output by three to "predict" 20th-century temperature correctly.

A spate of recent scientific papers, gearing up for the UN's fourth report next year, gives a different reason for the failure of reality to keep up with prediction. The oceans, we're now told, are acting as a giant heat-sink. In these papers the well-known, central flaw (not mentioned by Stern) is that the computer models' "predictions" of past ocean temperature changes only approach reality if they are averaged over a depth of at least a mile and a quarter.

Deep-ocean temperature hasn't changed at all, it's barely above freezing. The models tend to over-predict the warming of the climate-relevant surface layer up to threefold. A recent paper by John Lyman, of the US National Oceanic and Atmospheric Association, reports that the oceans have cooled sharply in the past two years. The computers didn't predict this. Sea level is scarcely rising faster today than a century ago: an inch every 15 years. Hansen now says that the oceanic "flywheel effect" gives us extra time to act, so Stern's alarmism is misplaced.

Finally, the UN's predictions are founded not only on an exaggerated forcing-to-temperature conversion factor justified neither by observation nor by physical law, but also on an excessive rate of increase in airborne carbon dioxide. The true rate is 0.38 per cent year on year since records began in 1958. The models assume 1 per cent per annum, more than two and a half times too high. In 2001, the UN used these and other adjustments to predict a 21st-century temperature increase of 1.5 to 6C. Stern suggests up to 10C.

Dick Lindzen emailed me last week to say that constant repetition of wrong numbers doesn't make them right. Removing the UN's solecisms, and using reasonable data and assumptions, a simple global model shows that temperature will rise by just 0.1 to 1.4C in the coming century, with a best estimate of 0.6C, well within the medieval temperature range and only a fifth of the UN's new, central projection.

Why haven't air or sea temperatures turned out as the UN's models predicted? Because the science is bad, the "consensus" is wrong, and Herr Professor Ludwig Boltzmann, FRS, was as right about energy-to-temperature as he was about atoms.
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Offline laser_jock99

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« Reply #4 on: March 14, 2007, 00:22:31 »
All this global warming nonsense is about hidden politcal agendas. Dig a little deeper and there are reasons why our 'leaders' would like us to believe all this b*llsh*t. It's mainly because they want us to be worried about something. If we're worried about something they can control us us more easily.  During the Cold War we had the Russians to worry about and possible nuclear anihilation (the climatologists were predicting another ice age in the Seventies...). Next we had the Muslims/Iraq. now it's the Climate and - cunningly- 'we' are the problem, 'we' are our own enemy. How clever is that?

I reported in an earlier thread Mars was waming up. Not only Mars I find but the other planets too....

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2006/161106suvjupiter.htm

There are plenty of skeptics out there:

http://www.propagandamatrix.com/articles/february2007/130207globalwarming.htm

http://www.canadafreepress.com/2007/global-warming020507.htm
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Offline Eeyore

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« Reply #5 on: March 14, 2007, 08:09:18 »
Anyone see the last report from the government concerning global warming? The one where they used all the ice-core data?

Interestingly, about 15,000 years ago the entire coast of Antartica was exposed. It wasn't covered in 2000m of ice.

Interestingly, all the ice core data used in the report stopped before then, so we were presented with no evidence of what happened leading up to the last ice age.

See, it a bit hard to determine long term trends when they only give you  very short term data.  :roll:

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Offline laser_jock99

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« Reply #6 on: March 14, 2007, 13:12:38 »
The more I read  about all this the more I believe it's less about real concern for the environment and more about ecconomics & control of the poplace. The people I feel sorry for are those 'do gooders' who been sucked in by it all and are spouting on as if it was fact!

I'm begining to wonder if European Governments in particular are gearing up to use CO2 emmisions as a trade lever against the likes of India & China? Like slapping on an 'emmisions tax' on cheap Chinese imports because they don't confirm to EU standards. The EU and USA have big problems with not being competive in producing goods at the moment- the trade defecit is huge (something like US$850Bn). It would be a good stick to beat the Chinese with under the guise of saving the planet. Remember- you read that here first!

Believe it not the EU is offering companies specific funding for ideas and inovations for making us competative with the Chinese! There's 4.5Bn Euro's up for grabs in the form of development grants apparently.
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Snake110

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more4 climate change program
« Reply #7 on: March 14, 2007, 15:51:51 »
heres a conspracy for you oil is running out FAST google "peak oil"
for background on this.

the global warming boll... err rubbish we are getting stuffed
down our necks constantly is a very convenient cover
for 1 forceing us to economise use of resorces
and 2 raiseing a nice tax windfall for HMG to
use to try and find alternative energy sources
to help prevent total collapse of life as we know it
in the uk.

i have read quite a few documents reports etc
on the state of oil and gas industrys
and from what i read the futures rather bleak
ALL of the major oil producing areas of the world
are reporting a slow but sure decline in production
and new sources are becoming harder to locate
and much more expencive to extract
noticed the slow but steady rise in crude prices?
ignoring sharp changes due to things like
9-11 and the gulf conflicts the baseline
price is riseing due to the oil companys
trying to squeze as much proffit as possible
whith whats left so to mantain themselves
and to provide funding to diverse in to other
industys and energy sources.

basicly the worlds major govenments are
behind closed doors in a major panic about
the future and are all drawing up plans
for warfare to secure what resorces remain
when not if it comes.

because as it is our civilisation is utterly dependant
on oil for industryal production ,transport and FOOD production.
without oil you have no cars no plastics no microprocessors no
lubrication for just about any mass production process.
in other words without oil we are back to the iron age at a stroke

oh and nuclear power wont work either if theres no oil to
lubricate the turbines !

the bio oils can can be used to replace some of the fossil
oils biodiesel etc the problem is we simply cannot produce enugh of it
to get even close to replaceing the worlds oil use at todays levels
you would need to convert most of the worlds arible land
to growing rapeseed etc problem there is there aint enough
arible land to grow food for us as it is never mind giving it all
over to oil produceing plants?!

on that note ill shutup and stop depessing myself
but ill say this do a bit of research its all avalable online
if you look hard enugh trust me global warming is the least
of our problems and manmade global warming
is an utter fantacy do you really think any governent
would tell you the truth or admit to any of this?
imagine the panic it could cause just read learn
and if you can be prepared...

Offline Range Rover Blues

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« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2007, 15:58:24 »
Quote from: "laser_jock99"
The more I read  about all this the more I believe it's less about real concern for the environment and more about ecconomics & control of the poplace. The people I feel sorry for are those 'do gooders' who been sucked in by it all and are spouting on as if it was fact!
.


The same do-gooder who would have us abondon our 4x4 and drive a Pious?  their lack desire to jump on the bandwagon without checking the facts lead to their downfall.  You can't con a man who isn't greedy.

Quote from: "laser_jock99"

I'm begining to wonder if European Governments in particular are gearing up to use CO2 emmisions as a trade lever against the likes of India & China? Like slapping on an 'emmisions tax' on cheap Chinese imports because they don't confirm to EU standards. The EU and USA have big problems with not being competive in producing goods at the moment- the trade defecit is huge (something like US$850Bn). It would be a good stick to beat the Chinese with under the guise of saving the planet. Remember- you read that here first!

Believe it not the EU is offering companies specific funding for ideas and inovations for making us competative with the Chinese! There's 4.5Bn Euro's up for grabs in the form of development grants apparently.


Tax on Chinese imports, not all bad then :?

Allwe need now is a tax on 'phone calls from people I can't understand and the rush to the east will be halted :wink:
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Offline RCRockCrawler

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« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2007, 18:01:20 »
It's a conspiracy!

Seriously, I agree that CO2 emissions aren't entirely the cause of global warming (or at least THIS global warming), but when you burn millions of tons of what was previously solid, liquid and gas carbon (coal, oil, and natural gas), you'll end up with more CO2 in't atmosphere.
A while ago at shool, we were given a graph of average Earth surface temperatures over the years. There was a general rise-followed-by-fall trend to the temps, but the most recent spike continued rising, way off the graph.
But, in another chart we saw at school, we saw the CO2 emissions for the 10 most developed countries. At the bottom of the chart was countries like Brazil, Sierra Leone, etc. Next up was countries like UK, France, Belgium and Germany. But then, miles up the chart, at least 6 or 7 times the size of Britains bar, were USA and China.

In short, the UK's emissions will make a negligble difference, much less the emissions of British 4x4s.  :wink:
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Offline Manicminer

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Offline Bob696

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more4 climate change program
« Reply #11 on: March 17, 2007, 09:20:25 »
Quote
we were given a graph of average Earth surface temperatures over the years. There was a general rise-followed-by-fall trend to the temps, but the most recent spike continued rising, way off the graph.


Sorry but this appears to be a case of manipulating figures and scales to prove what you want.

Todays temperature is only just above that of 1940 (the average temperature fell year on year from then until about 1980).

Around the 12th century the average temperature was SIGNIFICANTLY higher than today, somewhere in the order of 2-3 C. People farmed in Greenland, the Chinese sailed around the artic sea and vinyards exsisted over most of england.

In the 17th century it was much colder. The Thames froze over and there was famine.

Where would you start your graph to prove global warming was happening????

I have seen NO evidence that CO2 causes global warming. There are many more 'greenhouse gases' than just CO2 and most are in a much more signicicant percentage (H2O?)

Bring back the cold war, it gives the nieve something more tangable to worry about so that the goverment can control them that way and leaves me to get on with my life.
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Offline blueboar

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more4 climate change program
« Reply #12 on: March 17, 2007, 15:23:56 »
What  melted the last iceage???
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Offline DiscoveRay

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Global warming
« Reply #13 on: March 17, 2007, 19:51:12 »
Mars is also subject to global warming - OK who's been driving their 'gas guzzling 4 x 4s' on Mars?

Come on - own up :lol:

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Offline Range Rover Blues

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Re: Global warming
« Reply #14 on: March 17, 2007, 20:45:16 »
Quote from: "DiscoveRay"
Mars is also subject to global warming - OK who's been driving their 'gas guzzling 4 x 4s' on Mars?

Come on - own up :lol:

Ray


It's not the 4x4 it's that old Cortina running on leaded 4 star that caused that :lol:
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