AuthorTopic: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?  (Read 2274 times)

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Offline muddymud

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v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« on: April 06, 2009, 22:03:55 »
i have just got myself a 3.5 v8 rrc, i am a bit annoyed as all my friends say i can only go in water about half way up the wheel. but i see loads of v8's with water up to the windows and they are fine what do i have to do so i can do that?

cheers,
Nick

Offline turbonutter

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2009, 22:23:49 »
do a search bud there loads of threads

lots of silicone and a rubber glove is a cheep way !!
just go round and seal the dissy , plug leads and any electrics to do with the ignition system

we have had 2 v8 rrc's and they were nothing but trouble , personaly i dont like the rover v8 ( apart from the sound  :twisted:)

Offline carracarra13

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2009, 22:36:59 »
well Ive got a 3.9 v8 discovery just cristened her today ( shed never been off tarmac in her 15 year life )  i used to be the same after one rrc that was a pita, but the disco no problem and trust me she nearly went floating down the river no problemm other than me getting used to her, go through water slower take some one with you just in case you do need a tow,  use vasiline for water proofing dont use the rubber glove if the dizzy gets wet it cant dry out get a good waterprofer Holts do a darn good one, have a look on rpi internationals site some sound info from guys whov lernt the hard way also wd40 can get you out of some very sticky problems it drys every thing out but dos not last (avoporates) so you need to reapply personaly Ive found the classics less than reliable . esp lpg with wet dont mix, a large ps GET A SNORCAL FITTED ASAP to your truck not you lol
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Offline Skibum346

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2009, 16:59:24 »
Step one... make sure your cables and ignition parts are all in good order. I recommend the magnacor ones... but be warned.. cheap they aint!

Step two... Get a can of chain grease for motorbikes and spray it around the spark plugs and dizzy cap connections (messy... but effective)

Step three... Cut a 2 litre pop bottle in half, feed the king lead and associated wires through the top and connect them to the coil... using the bottle to form an open guard that allows things to dry out if they need to.

Step four... Use the other end, upended, to form the same kind of thing to protect the dizzy cap.

and the snorkel line from Carracarra is no joke...! If water gets in it will only compress so far... then your con rods, will bend and something will come out the side of the block!

Good luck... and welcome!

Offline Oli-L

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2009, 08:33:45 »
I was looking for info on this myself and came across this....


how to make the Rover V8 resistant to ignition failure in water.
First of all you need to decide just how water proof your engine needs to be, I will briefly ouline three options here;
1.) Splash proof - this is all you need for most off roaders that dont have snorkles.
2.) Short term wading - For off road racing where you are getting water forced into the engine bay.
3.) long term wading - For seriouse off roaders with full snorkle that will drive with water line above top of engine.
Water causes the high tension side of the ignition to arc to ground only if it has a path righ to the conducting parts of the system. Similarly it can effect the low tension side too. All we need to do is stop it getting to those parts.
First of all, it is vital to have the basic parts of the system in good order before we start modifiying anything else. Good quality 8mm silicone leads should be fine (even 30000 volt systems wont arc through that much silicone!). You dont need any special purpose leads just good quality standard ones. Make sure the boots at each end are either bonded on or very tightly fitting, you could bond them in place with silicone but its better to start with decent leads in the first place. With new spark plugs the new leads should fit with a water tight seal anyway. Old leads go hard and will leak here. The same goes for the dizzy cap end. The dizzy cap should again be a good quality standard item, check it fits the dizzy casing well and that the centre electrode spring works properly.
With all the low tension connectors, I always spray them with contact grease to prevent corrosion. The coil driver (SD1 or Land Rover types) will work quite happily under water as the electronics is sealed anyway but a coating of spray grease will help prevent problems if there are any small cracks in the resin.
With the basics sorted, your next problem is the dizzy itself. In particular the two breather holes in the casing just below the advance weights. These holes are very important, they prevent a build of of crank case gasses (which leak up the dizzy shaft) which could otherwise blow the dizzy appart. Here the three options come in.
1.) Splash proof.
If you are mostly green laining and have problems with the engine spluttering every time you go fording, the chances are that a small ammount of moisture is getting through the breathers and causing a bit of arcing in the dizzy cap. In most cases a simple splash gurd will direct the water away from this area and all will be well. In some vehicles water will be thrown up by the crank pully so a small shield is needed here. The shield only needs to be a thin piece of plastic held on to the dizzy with a tie wrap or similar, as long as it is secure. Remember to put some silicone grease round the base of the dizzy cap to help the seal.
2.) Short term wading.
This is when you are driving through small rivvers quickley (shuch as in a Comp Safari race) wher there is water everywhere in the engine bay but it is not actually submerged. Good splash guard should still work for most applications but if not then now the breathers need to be dealt with. Take the dizzy out of the engine and drill the holes out and tap them for 2BA breather nipples, make sure you trim the thread of the nipples down to 1.6 mm else you risk them fouling the advance weights, always check on your dizzy how much clearance you have. Then drill an tap for another nipple just down stream of the throttle (this will draw gas out of the dizzy) and one between the throttle and air filter (this will let clean air in to the dizzy), see pictures below. I got the nipples and some silicone tubing from a model shop, apparently they use it for fuel on model aeroplanes, costs a couple of pounds. Reassemble the dizzy into the engine (check alignment and not just timing) and you should be able to throw a bucket of water at the engine without it missing a beat.
3.) Long term wading.
If the water line is above the top of the engine then you have the additional problem of condensation and water seeping under pressure through every joint in the system. Proceed as in the above example but you will also need to bond in and seal the electrical connection on the dizzy and also the joint between the vacuum advance unit and the dizzy body. Some vacuum advance units have a breather hole which will have to be connected to fresh air via a pipe as well. If you are doing this sort of work then you will by now have many breather pipes (rocker covers, axle etc) but dont be tempted to connect this to one of the other breather pipes as a small pressure change will effect timing. The dizzy cap will have to be bonded to the base with silicone sealent which will have to be replaced every time you take the cap off.
So there you have it, there are more advanced ways and there are definately more expencive ways but this is all you realy need to sort out the ignition on that splendid V8.


Offline Range Rover Blues

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2009, 13:39:55 »
Spend all that money making the V8 waterproof (and you can, the army did it) then you get to spend another fortune fixing the axles and gearbox when they get full of water too, then put in another interior and whilst you are at it fix up all the rusty holes in the floor.

I just don't get why people insist on driving through water so deep it comes up to their waist, surely a boat would have been cheaper?
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Offline muddymud

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2009, 21:47:15 »
I was looking for info on this myself and came across this....


how to make the Rover V8 resistant to ignition failure in water.
First of all you need to decide just how water proof your engine needs to be, I will briefly ouline three options here;
1.) Splash proof - this is all you need for most off roaders that dont have snorkles.
2.) Short term wading - For off road racing where you are getting water forced into the engine bay.
3.) long term wading - For seriouse off roaders with full snorkle that will drive with water line above top of engine.
Water causes the high tension side of the ignition to arc to ground only if it has a path righ to the conducting parts of the system. Similarly it can effect the low tension side too. All we need to do is stop it getting to those parts.
First of all, it is vital to have the basic parts of the system in good order before we start modifiying anything else. Good quality 8mm silicone leads should be fine (even 30000 volt systems wont arc through that much silicone!). You dont need any special purpose leads just good quality standard ones. Make sure the boots at each end are either bonded on or very tightly fitting, you could bond them in place with silicone but its better to start with decent leads in the first place. With new spark plugs the new leads should fit with a water tight seal anyway. Old leads go hard and will leak here. The same goes for the dizzy cap end. The dizzy cap should again be a good quality standard item, check it fits the dizzy casing well and that the centre electrode spring works properly.
With all the low tension connectors, I always spray them with contact grease to prevent corrosion. The coil driver (SD1 or Land Rover types) will work quite happily under water as the electronics is sealed anyway but a coating of spray grease will help prevent problems if there are any small cracks in the resin.
With the basics sorted, your next problem is the dizzy itself. In particular the two breather holes in the casing just below the advance weights. These holes are very important, they prevent a build of of crank case gasses (which leak up the dizzy shaft) which could otherwise blow the dizzy appart. Here the three options come in.
1.) Splash proof.
If you are mostly green laining and have problems with the engine spluttering every time you go fording, the chances are that a small ammount of moisture is getting through the breathers and causing a bit of arcing in the dizzy cap. In most cases a simple splash gurd will direct the water away from this area and all will be well. In some vehicles water will be thrown up by the crank pully so a small shield is needed here. The shield only needs to be a thin piece of plastic held on to the dizzy with a tie wrap or similar, as long as it is secure. Remember to put some silicone grease round the base of the dizzy cap to help the seal.
2.) Short term wading.
This is when you are driving through small rivvers quickley (shuch as in a Comp Safari race) wher there is water everywhere in the engine bay but it is not actually submerged. Good splash guard should still work for most applications but if not then now the breathers need to be dealt with. Take the dizzy out of the engine and drill the holes out and tap them for 2BA breather nipples, make sure you trim the thread of the nipples down to 1.6 mm else you risk them fouling the advance weights, always check on your dizzy how much clearance you have. Then drill an tap for another nipple just down stream of the throttle (this will draw gas out of the dizzy) and one between the throttle and air filter (this will let clean air in to the dizzy), see pictures below. I got the nipples and some silicone tubing from a model shop, apparently they use it for fuel on model aeroplanes, costs a couple of pounds. Reassemble the dizzy into the engine (check alignment and not just timing) and you should be able to throw a bucket of water at the engine without it missing a beat.
3.) Long term wading.
If the water line is above the top of the engine then you have the additional problem of condensation and water seeping under pressure through every joint in the system. Proceed as in the above example but you will also need to bond in and seal the electrical connection on the dizzy and also the joint between the vacuum advance unit and the dizzy body. Some vacuum advance units have a breather hole which will have to be connected to fresh air via a pipe as well. If you are doing this sort of work then you will by now have many breather pipes (rocker covers, axle etc) but dont be tempted to connect this to one of the other breather pipes as a small pressure change will effect timing. The dizzy cap will have to be bonded to the base with silicone sealent which will have to be replaced every time you take the cap off.
So there you have it, there are more advanced ways and there are definately more expencive ways but this is all you realy need to sort out the ignition on that splendid V8.



thanks thats spot on, should be able to go racing round and not worry about the water in the ruts  :dance:

cheers,
nick

Offline 300TDi Disco

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2009, 23:36:46 »
If you have the EFI rubbish like i got, then make sure you cover the injector ballast pack. It can start to cause problems when it starts to fill up with water.
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Offline doda456

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2009, 18:33:10 »
Where is and what does the injector ballast pack look like? Im going to try and find mine and waterproof it, just as soon as I figure out what/where it is

dan

Offline BobtailBogey

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2009, 20:57:58 »
Spend all that money making the V8 waterproof (and you can, the army did it) then you get to spend another fortune fixing the axles and gearbox when they get full of water too, then put in another interior and whilst you are at it fix up all the rusty holes in the floor.

I just don't get why people insist on driving through water so deep it comes up to their waist, surely a boat would have been cheaper?

Totally agree  :)

my V8 seems to love water but i only take it through 2ft max but do get a lot of splashing around the engine bay and its never missed a beat.

i do keep the plugs and leads cleaned and lubricated very often though.
3.9 Auto RRC new project.
Already 3" lift and 265/75 Muds.

Offline carracarra13

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #10 on: April 12, 2009, 21:00:16 »
rrb I agree with you we only go 2ft migh push 2.5 as love our truck too much
v8 3.9 se discovery
pland mod lpg or hydrogen kit ?
allterains
twin battery, and water proofing engin and electrics
imverta

Offline 300TDi Disco

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Re: v8 water no water? what do i have to do?
« Reply #11 on: April 14, 2009, 20:49:59 »
Where is and what does the injector ballast pack look like? Im going to try and find mine and waterproof it, just as soon as I figure out what/where it is

dan


I took my injector pack out and got some pics for you. Location I'm not sure about on others as mine has got the range engine in the 90. Hope this helps you out.
P.S. I put the whole pack in a plastic bag then taped it up. haven't had any problems since.(touch wood)
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