superwinch H14

[wizard]

Hi All
I am about to take of my H14 winch and strip it down as the engage/disengage knob is seized.
I also need a few parts.
Where can i get the lever that operates to PTO gearbox ? and if i end up making one i assume its mounted somewhere near the hand brake lever.
I have two driveshafts with the winch (both the same) but looking at the PTO output driveshaft and the winch driveshaft the gearbox crossmember looks like it will be in the way.
Should I cut a bit out of it and re enforce it with a bit of plate or does it need replacing with a different one.

Regards
wizard

[Saffy]

have you not got a copy of the proper landie fitting manual for that winch? I can hook you up.

I have said winch, pto mech driven opposed to hydraulic, fitted to my 300tdi 110 so can provide further info.

the PTO engagement lever is a super simple affair and trivial for man of your skills to make. It does come out of a drill hole in the seatbox located between the handbrake and the transmission tunnel. The manual gives the measurements for that hole location.

There is no modification of the gearbox x-member required.You should have two carriage bearing mounts which the drive shafts run thru, one located on the engine sump and other is located ...er I will have to have a look and edit/update later).

[Saffy]

here is the h14 strip down instructions I have used when i unstuck mine by the way (you only need strip one end). You can get the drum end seals from superwinch if needed, i have part number somewhere they are pretty cheap too.

To strip your H14 do the following:

Strip Down

1/. Remove the tie bar that links the two red housings together.

2/. Stand the winch on it's end with the drive housing lowest. Attempt to lift off the free spool housing complete. It 'should' lift straight off. But the winch drive shaft may be siezed in the spherical bearing in the free spool housing. Just use to tyre levers or simlar to pry the red free spool housing off aginst the drum flange. If you damage the lip seal around the drum flange - don't worry it will be perished any way and they are only a few quid. Put the free spool housing to one side.

3/. Remove the the big circlip from the end of the exposed winch center shaft. You will need to push the drum back allong the winch center shaft to allow this to come off as the drum is being pushed against the circlip by the two sprung anti rotation 'buttons' between the drum and drive housing.

4/. Slide the drum off the winch center shaft. If your unlucky the shaft will be rusty in the center - this will mean the drum gets stuck after sliding allong the winch shaft about 1". It will move with a bit of persasion. However if you choose to hit the drum flanges to get it to move - BE CAREFULL. The weld between the flanges and the drum center tube will facture........ Put your now fractured drum to one side.

5/. You now just have the drive housing left with the input shaft and the winch center shaft sticking out of it. If you want to strip it make sure you keep the parts in order so that the shims go back in the right place. Remove the propshaft UJ from the input shaft. Remove the 4 allen head bolts around the input shaft. Hold the winch center shaft in one hand and rotate the input shaft. One way will wind the input shaft and worm out of the drive housing. Note that there are a number of shims between the input shaft removable bearing housing and the roller thrust bearing. These set the end float on the input shaft/worm gear. Don't loose!

6/. Now undo the 8 set screws that hold the circular plate on the end of the drive housing. The plate should then come off with a bit tapping on it;s edge. Don't stick a screw driver down the gasket face - you will damage the aluminum faces on the housing or the plate. This will result in the plate not sitting flat when you rebuild it - this will make the winch shaft end bearing sit at an angle to the shaft. Note that the gasket thickness used to seal the plate onto the housing and the little shim that fits in the bearing housing on the reverse side of the plate set the end float of the winch center shaft. If you don't get the right gasket from superwinch, or cut your own from the right thickness gasket paper you will need to adjust the end float using a different little shim - Get the right gasket!

7/. You should now be looking into the drive housing and be seeing the big wheel gear. The winch center shaft should now slide out towards you.

8/. Go back to the Free spool housing. Remove the 4 allen head cap screws that hold on the free spool lever locking mechanism. The locking mecahnisam should now just lift off.

9/. Lay the free spool housing down so you are looking into it. You should see a roll pin that loactes the engagement fork onto the free spool lever shaft. Drift it out. The free spool lever and shaft should now come out of the housing. Often they are siezed. If so drill a small hole in the plastic plug on the front face of the free spool housing. This will allow you to use a screw driver to leaver out the plug. You can now use a drift to knock the free spool lever out.

10/. The splined dog collar should now be free to lift out of the housing complete with the engagement fork.

11/. The last component in the free spool housing is now the spherical bearing. This should spin and be free to tilt. If you need to remove it you need a external bearing puller with a slide hammer. Alternatively turn a bit of hard wood down so that it just fits into the bearing bore. Pack the inside of the bearing with grease, fit the wooden shaft on top and hit with a hammer (wear safety glasses) - it will hydraulicaly push the bearing out.

12/. Clean up your componets/check condition etc.

I would suggest that you do not remove the bearings either side of the wheel gear. You will need a big press to remove the wheel to get at the back bearing. The worm and wheel are an industrial quality gear set running on proper bearings (unlike most winches). Unless you have had a bearing failure or oil contamintation they should be OK to reuse. If not they are all available from a bearing stockists (even the spherical bearing). You need to knock out the 'core plug' to change out the roller bearing at the non drive end of the worm gear.

Reassembly.


1/. Start by fitting a new lip seal into the drive housing for the winch center shaft. Pack the ball bearings either side of the wheel gear with grease - they don't sit in the oil. Put the drive housing on your black and decker work mate so that you can them lower the winch center shaft and wheel gear assembly into the housing.

2/. Use a bit of grease to hold the small shim in the bearing pocket of the housing end plate. Use a new gasket and fit the end plate. It may need gently tapping on over the bearing. If it is sticking, take it off and put it in the oven at 150C. It will expand enough to slide on. Fit and do up the 8 set screws. Check the winch center shaft is free to turn - is should spin easily and have negliable end float. If it doesn't turn easily you have probably trapped the small shim.

3/. Turn the drive housing on it's side so that you are looking into the hole the worm goes in. Using a screw driver or similar drop the thrust bearing into it's recess. Put the worm gear into the drive housing by rotating it to screw it past the wheel gear. Fit the drive end thrust bearings and the shims, place the aluminium end cover on and do up the 4 allen head cap screws. Check the input shaft turns freely. Also check the input shaft end float. With the winch center held tightly you should have about 0.010" end float (this is my figure, superwinch were reluctant to tell me the correct one, so I measured the end float before I stripped mine)

The rest is the the reverse of the strip B) .

Adrian

[Saffy]

I dunno if mud club has room to host the h14 and pto fitting manual? It's copyright superwinch but free to distributed (as long as not modified or sold) 'obsolete' electronic pdf copy which they supply and stands at 1.7Mb.  I am no longer willing to support my web server which hosted such files so shame to loose rare file.

[wizard]

Hi
thanks for the above info.
I started to take the winch off last night. I cant get the rollers off the fairlead to get the hook through, so i will end up cutting the rollers off or chopping the fairlead in half !!

I also noticed that when i put the PTO box on its hanging at the wrong angle, so i will need to rotate that a bit.

There is a small hole between the handbrake and transmission tunnel, so it looks as if the whole winch system was fitted at some point.

I you can e mail me the fitting manual i would be eternally gratefull.

Regards
wizard

[Saffy]

pm your emaill addy.

Eh? Destroying the roller fairlead I think would be an unwise move, the non standard size is rocking horse poop and give you no end of hassle to replace... just remove the rope totally from drum as you will need to do that anyway as it too blooming heavy to work with otherwise.The end of rope is held to drum with two grub screws which are probably seized.  Also  its cheaper and easier to cut hook off rope and refit/swage that if for some bizarre reason you can't remove rope fully. . I use synthetic rope and the hawse fairlead was machined by goodwinch for a fair few penny.

You may find the PTO drop box was modified by a previous owner to rotate it at an angle so that it doesn't hang straight down in such a vulnerably location as it does as standard.

[wizard]

Hi

I had to cut the rollers off because the winch enguage/disenguage clutch had seized.
I'll machine up some new rollers next week.

Eventually got the lump on the bench, it weights a ton. I think the front of the defender went up 2 inches once i managed to lift the winch off.

I stripped off the end housing and freed up the dog clutch, just got to get the housing back on and refit it.

wizard

[Saffy]

fair enough then on the reason to cut fairlead, nice to see what you come up with - take some pix and post to thread when you machine up something... maybe something you can sell in future... I might be interested if i ever go back to steel rope. but as you now know the winch with that rope (13mm rope that was on mine) weighs down the front no end where as the synthetic is negligible weight (but these days I do not keep rope on the winch at all for security reasons). Mine does have H.D springs on front too.

Have sent the fitting manual to the addy in your pm. 

Pretty straightforward releasing the clutch, mine is still nice and free.

[wizard]

The winch is sorted and back on the truck.
I made up an operating lever for the PTO, but i am battling to get the drive shaft on.
I had two supporting brackets with the box of parts, one I have mounted on the transfer box about 6 inches from the PTO shaft, however it is not in line.
The other bracket was quite badly mangled, I know it fits to the front of the sump but it is not inline with the input shaft on the winch.

I also need some sort of sliding joint that goes between shaft and winch. I emailed Superwinch yesterday to see what spares they offer.

Is there anyone near Cardiff with an operation PTO winch that I can have a look at ?

SAFFY, does the drive shaft fit between the chassis and exhaust or between exhaust and sump ? and if possible can you send me a photo or two of the front and rear mountings of the shaft.

I also had a look on Youtube to see if I could find any good shots of the PTO system but so far drew a blank.

regards
wizard

[Saffy]

I will sort some photo out later for you.

the shaft runs between exhaust and sump, it's so close to sump towards rear it may even vibrate against it.

[Saffy]

The sliding joint is pretty simple affair, It's a piece of hex stock held into the UJ that's attached to winch with grub set screws, the other end is in a female hex cylinder that's welded to the end of the drive shaft, it has a grease nipple fitted to pack it out with grease. The whole lot rattles like hell on mine. You can also see that I have extended the steering damper bracket to drop it clear of the winch drive shaft.
If you can find an alternative to mounting it to the sump then do so as engine vibration causes everything to shake and rattle and also extra stress is put on the sump seal... mine now leaks from that area. I will re-bracket mine some time, probably coming off the chassis rail.

[Saffy]

any help?

[wizard]

Hi
Yes magic.
I still haven't sorted it yet though.
I am missing a few parts. I have two of the long shafts, but I am missing the short sliding shaft.
The long shafts that i have seem a bit two long and they go from the pto to within 6 inches of the winch, but it fouls on the sump.
I need the female part of the sliding shaft, then I can cut down one of the long shafts that I have to suit.
I emailed superwinch UK last week but have  had no reply.

regards
wizard

[Saffy]

i will pm you a contact email address and name within superwinch you might get a better response. I had good service with them when getting the manual and drum seals .

trouble is the part numbers do not usually mean anything to them anymore as they are obsolete, so need someone there totake time and walk through to identify what you  need, maybe a phone call to 'technical sales' might be better..... anyway pm on way.

you might find that yours came off a different engine model of vehicle of modified to fit one.

That's the thing with these winches. I paid top dollar for mine from a ex-commercial landy dealer just because I could be sure that it came off a 300tdi 110, was working and had all parts it should have. in fact you might want to give them a call and see if they have any 2nd hand spares for the h14 from their take offs. they wont have anything listed on website so it requires a phone call when sales guy isn't busy. I bought winch and side panels from them in past and it just required calling and asking... and taking a day trip there to collect. www.exmod.co.uk

[gnasha]

I dunno if mud club has room to host the h14 and pto fitting manual? It's copyright superwinch but free to distributed (as long as not modified or sold) 'obsolete' electronic pdf copy which they supply and stands at 1.7Mb.  I am no longer willing to support my web server which hosted such files so shame to loose rare file.

You could create a free account on megaupload upload the file there as long as its a created account it will stay there then just post lnk for download. only files uploaded without account get deleted after 30 days or something lke that

[Saffy]

with the aid of a bit of welding and two piece of angle, I modified the sump bracket yesterday to fit using two of these bolt holes on the engine block.....



my sump seal has indeed been split by the bracket vibration. anyway... it's good and solid now.